smarty156

Having moved from the UK to the U.S. (New York state) I've just been looking at getting a trials bike again and inevitably comparing costs. I would say bikes cost about the same uk v us. Entry fees per trial also pretty similar although maybe slightly dearer in the U.S. AMA license $49 versus £10 (about $15) for an ACU license. The big difference is in traveling and number of events. In the UK you can pretty much ride every week if you ride club trials, regional trials (I.e. North Kent) and Centre trials (i.e. South East England) and that's every month of the year, year round. Plus they would all be less than an hour drive from home. In the U.S., in New England (which is the closest I can find) the first trial of the year is the beginning of May and the last is in October. None in July at all. Travel is between 1 1/4 to 5 hours each way. To be fair, 5 hours is the exception and if you took that one out it would be about 3 hours max. As for travel cost, although they are probably 3 times as far in the US fuel is about 1/3 the cost so pretty even. But as mentioned, in the UK I'd be going to a lot more events so it would cost more in a year.

So, the bad news is I've just spoken to an experienced shipping company and they say there's no way I can have the bike shipped over to the US. Anything with an engine (even a lawn mower) would not be allowed in. I guess the silver lining is I'll be getting a new trials bike at some point in the next few months!!

Company is paying to have all our belongings shipped so I think I'll just get my current (4 month old) bike shipped over. Well, it's official now. Both my wife and I have handed our notices in at work (3 months minimum required) and the house is about to go on the market. Looking to arrive in the US on 24th November! So much to do, so little time .... Thanks for all the help and info, particularly Biff.

If you have a bike rack on the back of the car, do you need extra lights if the car ones are obscured (in the UK I use a small trailer board with lights, indicators and stop lamps)? I'm talking specifically New York State. If searched and can't find anything.

Thanks for the info. PM sent. I have been to the US a few times (spent our honeymoon driving 2,500 miles from Vegas to Utah mountains, Death Valley, Yosemite, San Fran and then down the west coast amd eventually to LA) but it's obviously not the same as living there so it's good to speak to people that actually do live there.

Thanks again for the hitch info. I think what I'll do is get an SUV (it would be useful for us to get a 7 seat vehicle for when family come over) so I'll get one with a type 3 hitch (2 inch). Looking at something like a new Ford Explorer, which seems to tick all the boxes. I'll bring my current bike rack over as well. This bolts onto a flange faced tow bar over here. I'll just get someone to weld a vertical plate onto a 2 inch removable ball mount bar with the 2 bolt holes in the right place for my bike rack (and bicycle rack as well). Are there any rules over there regarding tampering with the removable bar? Over here you're not allowed to change anything as they have to be type approved. You can't just make you're own tow bar up. Here's what I mean by a flanged towbar: http://towbars.co.uk/static/towbar-types

Even with my wife only currently working 4 days a week and both of us getting 6 weeks holiday a year we still don't have enough to cover all the school holidays. We pretty much have the same amount of school holidays but it's spread out a bit more here (a week in October and 2 weeks at Easter instead of only 1 but then we only have a 6 week summer holiday). So this year the kids went to a camp (8.30am to 5.30pm) for a week at Easter and they'll be going again for 2 more separate weeks in the summer. Luckily it's not far from where I work but there are very few of these here. I guess there's more things like that over there? Not really a problem in the short term as I won't be able to work anyway so I can always do things with them but just trying to look a bit longer term in case I do want a job. Biff - what vehicle do you use to take your bike to trials? I currently have my bike on a bike rack across the rear of my Touareg. I've done some searching and see you can also get those out there. Your tow bars are different as you have receiver hitches - it looks like all the bike racks need a 2 inch receiver hitch (type 3 or 4?). I see that cars factory fitted with a hitch seem to have a smaller one. Is it just SUV type vehicles and pickups that tend to have the larger receiver or can you get them for cars as well. We'll obviously need to buy a car when we arrive and I don't want to get something that means I can't use a bike rack as it seems the best way to transport the bike, especially as the distances will be a lot greater.

Good point. Although I'm not sure I could cope with that for 2 months! On a serious note, if both parents work and they only get 2 weeks holiday a year each (ok, I know some get more) then during the year you must be paying a lot for summer camps/child care.

Thanks Biff. Well, she's still in NYC at the moment with another day left and they've made her an offer. Just need them to put it in writing with details of the relocation package, benefits etc (I know there's full medical for family and some pension arrangement). She needs to decide whether the job is what she wants, if it's enough money (I won't have a work visa so I can't work, at least for a while or I find a company willing to sponsor me for a work visa), if she can cope with full time (she currently does 4 days) and if she can get her head round the fact it will be me dropping off and picking up kids from school and not her. Lots to think about. She had a realtor take her round Mamaroneck and Rye on Sunday to show her the area, which she really liked. Watch this space! Just one question for you Americans - what do you do with the kids when they're off school for July and August? We won't have to deal with it yet but given most Americans only seem to get 2 weeks holiday a year (wife would get 4 weeks in new job so not too bad, although not the 6 weeks we both currently get) how do they cope with school holidays. Is it a case of signing them up for summer camps?

Thanks Biff. Fuel in the UK is currently around $9 per UK Gallon (around $7.50 per US Gallon) so driving the extra miles to get to trials shouldn't be too bad financially and will be a lot less day to day than we currently spend. I have a VW Touareg at the moment and to fill it up from empty costs about £135 or $200 in diesel. I'll be looking for a more economical vehicle if we move as it will mostly be a run around car (plus trials obviously!).

Thanks for all the info guys. NETA looks like they hold trials not too far away. It will take a bit of getting used to travelling a lot further to do a trial. At the moment I travel maximum 45 minutes and if I wanted could ride every week at lots of different locations (and I'm in South East England where we don't have much trials land). I've been riding trials (off and on in recent years) since I was 9 and I'll be turning 44 next week. Hadn't ridden for 5 years but started up again last October and ended up buying a new GasGas 300 in April! Trials is in the blood and I didn't want this potential move to put an end to that. Glad I can keep riding. At the moment it's still very much up in the air as to whether or not we would move out. Need to do a lot more research. If anything, it will be the money that will stop us as I won't have a work visa, just my wife. I'm not sure yet if living in Westchester (current favourite is Mamaroneck) on one salary with 2 kids will be possible or not. I'm a qualified accountant too so in theory should be able to get a job ok but we can't rely on that. The potential new employers are flying my wife out on Saturday (business class) and putting her up in a hotel near Grand Central until Wednesday night, when she'll fly home. Couple more interviews with very senior people (already had one interview in London and one in Brussels!) and observing a 3 day Board meeting. I don't think they'd do that unless they were going to offer her the job (could be wrong but that's an awful lot of expense if they're undecided). Could be wrong though. Hopefully we'll know at the end of next week and we can make a decision. In the mean time I'll have a look at those websites. Fingers crossed!!!

Thanks guys. Pretty much as I thought (i.e. Take my bike with me). Wife is being flown out to NYC next week for a few days for more interviews and to sit in on some board meetings to get a feel for it. We're still not totally sure if we're going to do it. Need to do more homework on costs, places to live etc. I won't be able to work initially but that's fine as it means I can get the kids and us settled in before looking for a job. Off topic but does anyone have any views on living in the Mamaroneck/Larchmont/Rye areas? Wife's job will be right next to Grand Central so thinking Westchester county would be best to keep the commute down? Also, could we do it on one salary of $160,000 (assuming medical provided and kids go to public school)? We'd probably rent for a year to get a feel but can't really move around due to kids (9 and 5) being in school. Rents around there aren't cheap and looks like $3-4,000 per month for something reasonable. Finally, back on to trials - can you point me to NY trials clubs on the web? Thanks again.

How much can I expect to pay (incl all taxes etc) for a 300 Gas Gas Pro (Standard) in the US (more specifically New York)? Can't find any prices on the net. Would I be better taking my bike with me if we move out there? Thanks

Clubs in our part of the country (South East) put on regular "Beginners & Wobblers" trials. These are aimed specifically at new riders - the sections could be ridden on a trail bike. It's purely to get people into the sport and to get them some practice and understanding of what a trial is. Maybe look to see if there are any of these type of trials in your area rather than starting off on a normal club trial? The other thing is ask. If you want help or advice on how to ride a section most people are more than happy to help. Finally, if a section scares you, miss it out. Wait until you're confident/skilled enough to tackle it. I've been an expert rider, riding Nationals Centre champion etc. However, now I'm over 40 I ride the over 40 route (Intermediate sections) as I just want to enjoy myself, especially having not ridden for the last 5 years. Now I've ridden a few events I want to get fit again and move back up to Expert before the end of the year. If I do and I come across a section that I don't like the look of (chance of breaking me or the bike), I'll take a 5 and move on. It's called being sensible. Don't be frightened to take a 5 without attempting the section. It's not uncommon. I do find sometimes that people who have ridden bikes a lot on the road or even motocross or grasstrack think that trials will be easy. It's not. That's why we like it - it's as much a challenge between you and the section as it is the other riders.

There is no handicap system in trials though. Nobody is saying they can't do no stop. On the contrary, I ride no stop better than I do stop permitted. Unfortunately, the results don't always show this due to everything I stated above. That kind of makes it a bit pointless under the current rules and marking. I'd be happy to stay no stop. I find it much easier, physically and now I'm over 40 that suits me! Just replace stopping and receiving a 5 with stopping (feet up) receiving a 1 (stopping feet down still a 5) and I think it would make a massive improvement to riders, observers and CofCs. Just my opinion though. Maybe we should have a poll? Current no stop rules v my no stop suggestion v something else entirely?

In theory I was in favour of non stop trials. When I started riding again late last year (having not ridden for 5 years) I read the non stop rules and thought great. I'm not as fit as I used to be plus I was never that great at hopping etc anyway. I ride "old school" - low revs, no stopping, no hopping or jumping if I don't need to. Trouble is, as ianw said above, non-stop is not really being run as non-stop in most places by most observers (and I'd also add Clerks of Courses). Why is that? Having observed a no stop trial now as well, I'm pretty sure it's because nobody really likes the current no stop rules as they are too harsh. As a rider I don't mind generally as it suits me but observers don't like it and it's the younger riders where we are (the ones that can and do hop and jump around a lot, even when they don't need to) that still ride the same (i.e. stopping and hopping) even in no stop trials. Observers are then being lenient with them which then makes a mockery of the no stop rules. Other riders then know they can get away with stopping and actually to be able to compete on a level playing field they have to ride the same. It's a shambles. As an example, at a recent combine event one of the best experts in the area rode the first lap proper no stop. It was a hard trial and he lost a fair few marks. However, he also then realised that the other riders were riding as though it was stop permitted and getting away with it (which made riding the sections much easier). Obviously, he then did the same from then on and his subsequent lap scores were much less. Unfortunately it was too late by then as his first lap ruined his total score and he didn't win like he normally would. We seem to have ended up with a hybrid set of rules, TSR22C - stop permitted as long as it's not too long but it's up to each observer what they think is too long, unless they're feeling particularly harsh and then you can't stop at all! Personally, I don't think it makes much difference to the attendance at trials either. People will ride, if they like the look of trials, whatever the rules (I don't like them but I still ride the trials). It's just a shame the rules aren't really working. The biggest problem where we are is lack of land. That means the same old pieces of land (usually small) are used time and again, mostly with similar sections. I think some people then get bored of the same old, same old.

If you push the silencer towards the wheel to get it more in line you'll be in danger of the tyre wearing through it.

Bring back Kickstart! When I was on it in the mid 80s everybody knew what trials was, even if they weren't actually into motorbikes. So many times, if I told someone I rode trials, they'd say "what, like on Kickstart?".

But that's exactly the point - under TSR22B it DOES constitute a failure. Have a read. It's just that you obviously don't like the rule, like a lot of others, so you're making up your own rules.

Good on you. Enjoy. Regarding the age thing - there's a guy in my club that's just turned 80 and he's just bought a new Gas Gas! Been riding trials for years.

Try explaining the current rules to a new rider/observer - yeah, see that guy that just rode through without putting a single foot down? Well, he just got a 5 (his rear wheel span on a loose rock and he stopped moving forward briefly) and that other guy that paddled his way through has beaten him by a clear 2 marks as he's only got a 3! It's ridiculous. Yes, you could have a top rider 3 every section if he stopped moving forward 3 or more times but at least he wouldn't get a 5 without ever putting his foot down! and don't you think he'd be doing his best not to stop and balance 3 times in a section? Another angle to this is that stopping and balancing feet up is a sign of some skill, balance and control (what I thought trials was about). Surely we shouldn't be actively discouraging that? I guess this just shows that even us riders can't agree so what chance do the powers that be have to make rules we all like? At the end of the day, we should be riding and observing to the rules as written, not bending them because we don't necessarily agree with them. Just to finish, you don't have to ride no stop - there is TSR22A "stop permitted" in ACU events. Clubs can opt for that if that's what the riders want. Our Club and Combine events are no stop but we have a team trial soon that is stop permitted. I'll let you know my thoughts on that after I've ridden it.

Yes, marking will always be subjective. I just think the current rules being so harsh where a stop, feet up or not, is a 5 makes observers want to be more lenient and so there's too much subjectivity coming in. Switching to 1 for a feet up stop would, in my opinion, drastically reduce the need for leniency and therefore subjectivity.

My new bike, about a month old now. Replaced an 04 280.

I tried a few GasGas bikes recently as I was looking to replace my 04 280 with a new one. I noticed that the Keihin carb on the Racing models has a much lighter spring which made the throttle a bit "trigger happy". I found the Standard bike to be a nicer/easier bike to ride due to that. Just pootling round there wasn't much difference between the 250s and 300s that I tried. I went for the 300 in the end as I like to ride a bit "old school" using the torque and not much revs. I just thought the 250 would be less suitable to my riding style and on the bigger stuff may not have enough. So it depends on how you ride and what level your at. For most riders below Expert level I think the Standard 250 would be perfectly fine. I've found the Standard 300 has masses of oomph when you rev it but is soft and torquing if you keep the revs down. Unless you're doing nationals (which I don't any more) I doubt anyone needs the Racing and, as demonstrated by some of the earlier posts advocating slow action throttles etc, actually in my opinion would be better off with the Standard. Oh, and in my case it was £900 cheaper than the Racing. I was also put off by a number of people, including dealers, moaning about the Keihin re having to re-jet, change slides, constantly adjust etc. And when I asked one rider who had added a Keihin to a Standard what it was like he said "Alright if it's dry", which didn't inspire me. It's your money though. Go and try and few out.

To clarify, what I meant was stopping (with feet up while balancing) would be a 1. Everything else as it is now I.e. stopping with foot/feet down, going backwards, dismounting etc all 5. With regard to the point about as long as an observer is consistent that's fine, I disagree. As a rider I want to know how I'll be marked on every section in a trial not have to guess section by section depending on how the observer is feeling that day. Therefore, anything that removes (or at least drastically reduces) the need for an observer to be lenient must be a good thing. How many observers would 5 a rider who had a superb ride on a difficult section just because at one point they momentarily stopped moving forward when someone that has a half hearted attempt and paddles through would get only a 3? However, same scenario but with my suggested revised scoring I'd bet virtually all observers would be quite happy to give a 1 to the rider that briefly stops moving forward. The observer would be under less pressure, there's less at stake for the rider so less likely to argue - everybody's happy. Whether or not sections are set out correctly to the rules is largely irrelevant at the trial. The observer has to observe the section and the rider has to rider it as it's laid out. You can moan at the CofC after if it makes you feel better but it won't change the result of the trial. I know how hard it is to set out sections so I wouldn't criticise a CofC. I have just returned to trials after about 5 years off. I had to look up what the current rules were. I then rode the sections as I found them within those rules. What's frustrating me now is that other riders aren't and they're getting away with it. That surely can't be a good state of affairs for trials. I know other riders that say they won't ride mark yourself trials as they, like me, will stick to the rules but others don't and consequently get a much better result. Just to add about lack of observers due to rider arguments, that's down to the club running the event and the Centre. If any observer is verbally abused by a rider then that rider should be excluded from the event. If they do it again the Centre should ban them.