Jet tower? I’ve cleaned everything inside the Keihin carb.
As linaway indicated checking the jet tower is a good idea.
Also, if you haven't checked and adjusted the jets that could help. Most people I know running a Keihin find a much larger low speed jet, smaller main, and needle setting change can make a big difference. It may sound a bit crazy but depending on the bike using anything from a 48-55 low speed, a 120-122 main jet, and a needle set between the middle to one lower around see level can run great. around 3-5k and a main of 118-120 and as low as 112 can be good at around 10k.
I did try all the swapping all the above parts when mine played up, fuel tank, injector, ecu, loom, temp sensor and a few times over but chasing an intermittent fault is tricky...
Sorry if there was any confusion, my comment was intended for 54tphill as he indicated his issue shows up inside 6 min or so.
With how quick you seem to see the issue an ECU swap/test should provide a lot of good information... If it still happens try swapping other parts, the capacitor, the throttle body, the injector... really could be a number of things at this point... good luck.
No i just pushed the pistons back i didnt take the lid off if that would make a difference thanks
I have never replaced my pads without also re-bleeding the system so not sure if it could, however its possible.
At this point I would do a flush and re-bleed of the system including re-adjustment of all the settings and see if your still having an issue. If you are then maybe its as lineaway indicated and your only choice is to modify the pin. If this is the case maybe you corrected a problem that wasn't causing an issue so you didn't know was an issue and now that is causing the issue you now have.
My best guess.
Edit: It would be highly unlikely the new pads by them selves would remove play from the system. Hydraulic systems auto adjust for changes in the system (pad ware, new pads, etc.) so it would be way more likely there is some other factor in play that is the cause of the difference not just new pads. Happy to be wrong if it really is the pads though...
The doesn't sounds like a fluid level issue... did you flush and re-bleed the system after replacing the pads? If not that is the first thing I would do and then re-adjust the lever. Good luck.
imho why i said fan drawing excessive current as montesa 4rt needs lights to be switched off to start /and a fan relay to cut fan off +3 kicks for starting that tells me there is no spare current in the system --- as the bike starts cold that says everything is working ! the only thing that then gets added to that system is the the FAN as the fan cuts in and out the fan motor gets hot ,drawing excessive current to turn until it draws too much current and cuts the bike out . Why not the fuel pump drawing to much current ? well the bike would cut out when the fan cuts in for the very first time- ---due to the fuel pump running constantly ,the highest current pull from the fuel pump is at start up to get the pump to turn thus the need for lights off and fan relay +the 3 kicks to charge the system fully up .
Good theory... I have never needed more than 1 kick to charge the capacitor/system and 1 to start the bike for any of the Montesa's I have or have ever been on. (currently have an 07 250 and a 17 300RR) So a low charge output from the system is a possible cause.
That theory makes me think a bit more about the capacitor making me think it isn't keeping enough of a charge. The initial fan startup could be putting to much drain on the capacitor and as a capacitor heats up, assuming its on its way out but not dead, they loose some of there ability to work and even stop working completely if they get hot enough in a part way failed state.
With that, I still vote, check it (preferably when hot) and even consider a replacement even if it seems good.
If you getting that kind of RPM dip when the fan stops I would start checking all of my ground wires and connectors are clean and greased up, and maybe test and/or replace the capacitor just in case.
Had great luck with my daughters 06 Rev 80 Sr, should be a great bike for him.. Great bike with only ever needing standard maintenance.
Note: before running it at all I would put a fuel filter on it between the tank and the carburetor. I am aware of at least 3 people getting small bits of debris from the tank causing some running issues on there Evo 08's.
Thanks im after wide ones really i have flat feet narrow pegs make my feet ache after a while
This is my issue as well, flat feet, and I find a mix of the S3 hard rock aluminium and the AlpineStars Tech T trials boots seem to do very well for my size 11 US feet. I think the combination of the stiffer sole on the A-Stars and the wider S3's seem to do well for me.
Looking them up they sure seem like they are their own thing with no connection to S3 directly and the design isn't the same, though a lot like them. Looks like they only have one type that works on trials bikes though. "Trials AS3 Racing Foot Pegs"
Hope someone can chime in with some experience with them and a real review for you soon.
The lanyard was fitted a year ago when I bought the bike but I’ll check that again.
you guys say “no spill cap” but there is a hole in it ? Like when I’ve dropped the bike fuel just come out of the cap?
I guess I missed the part about your lanyard being on the bike for along time already. Side thought, a fellow rider I know had a lanyard kill switch fail internally 8 weeks after he installed it, so still might be worth a check/test.
As for the cap, I noticed it wasn't stock so agreed with lineaway that they can cause issues so again worth a check. If you already know it doesn't have any kind of check valve and the whole is currently clear then you should be fine.
As for the hour/tach there should have been a set of instructions that tell you how to deal with RPM's being double what they should be. (I think I remember it was a HardLine unit you got? If so this is a link to their current instructions: https://www.hardlineproducts.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/8067-2download.pdf)
RPM Section:
Changing Spark/Pulse Input:
While in Tach mode, press and hold button until until “1P:1r” appears on the display.
Release button if this is the desired mode. Hold button to view more selections.
“1P:1r” indicates that the meter is set for 1 Pulse per 1 revolution.
“1P:2r” indicates that the meter is set for 1 Pulse per 2 revolution.
“2P:1r” indicates that the meter is set for 2 Pulse per 1 revolution.
If your RPM reading is double what it should be at idle you need to select “2P:1r”
I agree with lineaway to remove the no spill cap and see how things go. The two times I have tried one for any of my bikes I have had some kind of issue and ended up deciding not to do it again, no issues sense.
And always worth a look at any changes that recently happened such as jummyl's suggestion on going back to a kill button to test.
I've had and ridden most of the bikes in your group; 2017 Vertigo, 2018 Scorpa Factory, 2020 301RR.
Vertigo was fine once I got it dialed in but had to deal with fuel pump, maps and batteryless upgrades; spent about 20hrs drive time back and forth to the dealer to get al this resolved on a new bike. The newer ones are past these growing pains but put me off FI (had an Ossa before so was ready to deal with FI)
Got the 2018 Scorpa and loved it, simple and keeps going. Friend who rides his stuff hard had 350 trouble free hrs on his and I could see daylight around the head. Had a leaky petcock at the gas tank; pulled the petcock and put an oring between it and the tank, no leaks since. 150 hard hours on that bike and still in great condidtion
Buddy got a 2018 Sherco factory same time I got the Scorpa; he's had zero issues and the bike is really nice. Rides a little less snappy than the Scorpa, tuning is more stable but a good bike for sure.
Got a 2020 301 and tried to make it work for 20 hrs or so. I'm not a 4t guy and am selling it; had two of the worst trials in my life on it, just can't get the timing right and don't feel the need to take the time it needs to figure it out. Bike is very well put together and smooth, clutch is amazing; left side case cover has a pressure oil passage sticking out in the breeze that is an Achilles heel. Smashed it in a minor tipover and DNF'd, first DNF in 12 years. Cover was $380.....If you want to mention the leaky tank on the Scorpa you gotta' mention this.
Just took delivery on a 2020 Scopra factory a couple of weeks ago so you can tell where I ended up. 2t's feel like a Gazelle to me where as the 4t is more like a tiger; one is bouncy and flighty, the other wants a directed leap.
First and foremost, the OP isn't asking about a getting another Montesa so not sure how your cover issue is relevant to the current discussion. However seeing that your brining it up... It is true that the cover will cost a lot if you brake it, however there is a guard for the cover that can make a big difference (though not a 100% affective) but a leaky fuel tank to me is a much bigger deal as not only can this cause a DNF but to me is a much bigger deal as fuel all over me, the bike, the ground, etc. is much worse in a lot of ways in my opinion. And where I know not everyone has had the same level of trouble with the leaky tank but some are having really big issues with it and any issue that is that wide spread is a lot bigger deal that a few people that hit the cover (much less often an issue that the leaky tank).
I will also say that this doesn't make the Shecro's or Scorpa's a bad bike, they are great and other than the fuel tank issue I have nothing bad to say about them. As long as people are aware they might have a big issue with the tank and are willing to deal with it if it happens then they will have a fantastic bike. I just wouldn't be willing to spend $ on one tell that is sorted...
This is my experience and 2 cents...
Side note: I have been on Montesa's for over 10 years now and never hit that cover in a way to cause an issue even if I didn't have the guard on it, maybe I am just lucky? (shrug)
Have one guy in our group with a Vertigo and hia seems to be doing well over all for reliability and performance. We have a few TRS guys with good luck, and a good bunch of Betas doing very well.
not a big fan of the Sherco’s at the moment with the fuel leaks. So if I was going 2T I would probably go TRS or Vertigo... rather fond of EFI so would likely go that route at the moment but who’s to say I wouldn’t change my mind by the time I am ready to actually buy another bike. Very happy with my 17 Montesa 300 RR at the moment so no rush.
The kind of terrain i ride in, i cant believe someone would ever request that from a boot. ?
I don't know, a few small belt buckle or shoelace type grommets in the boot could really make a big difference in heat. Maybe place a couple on each side with about a 3 cm (1 inc) space between them down low, mid, and high. It could possibly lower discomfort a lot and help with fatigue. Worth testing out as long as you have an older pair of boots to play with and are willing to take on the risk it might compromise the boot.
Heck, I might give it a try with my old AlpineStars. hmmmm...
I have had good luck with Dunlop's and Michelin's in the mud myself. But seem to recall people saying that IRC's are good in the mud, though I have never tried them. I personally think the Michelin's are best over all so run them as my first choice, but with them being hard to get here in the US as of late I have been running Dunlops a lot as of late.
My mind is that just a new tire is the best for helping in muddy conditions myself as it has a sharper edge profile but I admit I only ride middle of the pack skill wise so take this all with a grain of sand. Good luck.
Unless someone chimes in on something I haven't seen yet at this point between what my family and I have tried Gaerne and ApineStars or the others my buddies have used (Wolf, Forma, and Hebo) non of them are any better than the others. Not sure about Stylmartin, Sidi or Mots but based on how they look I am going to guess not much better if at all.
On that note I would think putting a few grommet holes a pair might be a good way to get a bit of heat and moisture out of a pair and worth a try.
I would expect most rattle can paint to not deal with brake fluid well. If I was going to do a caliper I would See about that home power coating stuff.
Well, if you just had a larger radiator put in recently (at least that is what it sounded like in your second post) you might just have a bit of air in the system from that and topping it back up might sort it out? You could also double check temp Sensor?
Thanks for the reply and thanks for the good luck- it’s taking a bit of figuring out. . I’ve had it out again tonight. Runs spot on when cold- after 10-15mins riding the fan was kicking in and working as it should.(prior I maybe didn’t tax it enough as It’s had upgraded- larger radiator put on it. ) So after the 10-15mins radiator now working- but it’s still spluttering on and will eventually stall. It doesn’t sound like it’s idling fast enough. But I’m reluctant to alter Rickover as it’s still factory set - and has only be ridden for about 8-10 hours. It was sat, as a new bike, in a garage for year or so only being started up periodically. I wonder if that could have affected fuel pump?
The tickover was low when I first got my 300 RR new and it was factory set. I adjusted it strait away to eliminate the common issues that creates and haven't had an issue with it sense. So, based on you thinking idle is low, I would expect that this will likely will correct the problem, though I can't promise that. This is critical before attempting to troubleshoot anything else.
At one point I got something stuck in my fan and it messed up both the fan blades and the fan motor. As a result my bike did exactly the same thing you are talking about when it got warm and the fan tried to kick on. The only fix was to replace both in the end. I am sure the engine running issues (splutter) was caused by the issues in the fan motor but of course as I had broken blades so had to swap both. Once I relpaced the fan motor the bike has had zero issues (no splutter) ever sense.
Oh and I had to get the bike back to the car and the longer I ran it and the more the fan attempted to come on the worse it got tell it was fixed.
PS. If you haven't checked your idle is set to the correct 1800 RPM's I would do that first just in case.
So I think I have decided on the MONTESA, a new one as there seems to be genuine improvement over last year's, I've read they have dropped some carbon goodii, anyone know what they cut from the 2020 over the 2019. But the final question is is the Repsol worth £1000 more than the standard 4rt? , Suspension can make a bike much more confident and enjoyable, also I'd the S3 gasser pipe worth the £££ ,I probably don't need it, well I don't but if it improves all round engine it's maybe worth the investment to have a finished bike??
The rear shock of a standard is the primary bit I am not fond of so, you could spend a bit less on a standard and replace the rear with a TPR and it would make it a lot closer in comparison. Then again that is another $600 US so...
Also, having been on a 2017 standard, an 2014 Repsol and my 2017 300RR, I personally think that with the TPR comparison the Showa suspension is worth the $1K upgrade over the standard unless you want to ride the standard for a year or two before upgrading/changing anything.
As for the S3 pipe, I wouldn't bother with that unless your going to go all the way to the point of a programmable throttle body, but I have heard that it can still improve the feel of the bike without the ECU upgrade. But this isn't experience talking...
If you want a bit more throttle response then I agree go with the Montesa, in my opinion my 300 RR has quite a bit more instant response than my buddies Beta 300 I got a chance to ride. I will say you might also want to swap from the black throttle tube to the white on what ever Montesa you get if you want it to feel more responsive. I did the white tube swap on my 300 RR and it was well worth it in my opinion.
2020 model Gasgas 300 TXT starting issue
in Gas Gas
Posted
As linaway indicated checking the jet tower is a good idea.
Also, if you haven't checked and adjusted the jets that could help. Most people I know running a Keihin find a much larger low speed jet, smaller main, and needle setting change can make a big difference. It may sound a bit crazy but depending on the bike using anything from a 48-55 low speed, a 120-122 main jet, and a needle set between the middle to one lower around see level can run great. around 3-5k and a main of 118-120 and as low as 112 can be good at around 10k.
Good luck.