twinnshock

Forget Trials, I am more interested in "the fastest one man chain saw in the world" Stuart

I run a classic car and also a home built light aircraft so have been watching this ethanol issue for quite a while and reading as much as I can on this subject. Both my car and plane have had all rubber seals and fuel pipes changed so that they can deal with the ethanol. Officially I can run the plane on unleaded pump fuel without ethanol but.................. Unless I have missed this in this thread what has not been discussed is the change of specific gravity of the fuel with the addition of ethanol that can affect float height in the carb. Not an issue for your modern fuel injected car. My old BSA car was quite affected by this change when moving from leaded to non leaded and now with the addition of ethanol the setting required is moving back towards the old leaded value. Worth checking float heights? Stuart

So does anyone know if the M10 sold?

The thing I have learn't after many years restoring various motorbikes, cars and even an old airplane is that you need to want to restore the project and have a passion for what you are restoring if not you will soon lose interest and give up. The other thing I have also found by experience is that restoring is expensive. I have an extensive workshop and never send out anything to be done by others I can do myself and even doing most work myself I usually end up spending more on them than they are worth. I think this is why we see to may over priced restored examples on ebay that do not seem to sell. So ask yourself why are you doing this? If this is to sell on the completed project at a profit. Do not do it. If because you will enjoy working on the project and want to. Go for it. Bultaco's are fairly simple to work on and restore and parts easy to obtain. Excellent for somebody new to restoring to gain experience. The fact you are on here asking makes me suggest that you might not have the right motivation to complete this particular bike restoration. My first reaction to reading your post was to tell you NO. Advice I was given many years ago and have found useful is to try and do something to the restoration every single day even if it is only for 5 minutes. This keeps the restoration fresh in your mind and progressing and before you know it you will have a beautifully restored Bultaco ready to go out and cover in Mud. Stuart

Did I touch a nerve? Stuart.

Woody, I am more than aware of the value of this bike and what it would cost to put back to what in my opinion is a usable bike, and lets face it still a 1965 spec model 10. And that is from somebody who quite frankly loves these bikes. I have been watching the value of Bultaco's for many years and have watched the values drop in the last couple of years. I would also not want to spend more than half the opening price. A couple of years ago you could sell a model 10 to Spain for quite a sun. I know, I did. At the Braintree trial just after Christmas we has a local chap bring along a M10 he had for sale. The story was he was clearing out his sadly no longer with us brothers shed. The bike not used for many years had a M10 frame butchered and modified and a engine that was seized. Radial head, 4 speed but with no numbers on the engine. Correct hubs but very rusty forks, A butchered modified lower yoke. Modified rear brake. Wrong exhaust. Tank unit from a Alpina. In need of total restoration needing far more parts than listed above. In my opinion only good for breaking. Asking price offers in the region of £800. However a member of Colchester club has just spent £9000 in a James Trials bike. Admittedly supposed to be restored and ready to go so there are still a few out there with more money than common sense. (I wonder if he is reading this?) If a model 10 is usable in the pre 65 this will have an affect on value. Stuart.

Perhaps now they are eligible for the pre 65 SSDT the M10 that has been listed on ebay several times (4 time I think) staring bid at £4000 without selling (last time finished 8th January) will soon find a buyer! Does not look toooo bad...... original IRZ carb replaced with Amal and the exhaust is cranked downward but in my opinion would need a fair bit spending to get up to standard. I would be concerned with the tank condition based on what appears a repair on the top and I probably think others think the same hence still not sold. Stuart

I have been watching this topic with interest as a M10 owner. I must admit I did not at first read of the eligibility rule document think the Model 10 was eligible, just a clarification that a Bultaco must be 4 speed. I am aware riders have tried to enter on early bikes re-engined with a 5 speed engine in the past. In my opinion not a lot different to entering a 175 4 speed Bantam but what do I know. I took the document to just cover the pre model 10 bikes fitted with original engines. But it appears from this thread that a M10 is entered so again what do I know. Lets be clear on this a Model 10 is not pre 65. All I need to do now is convince the so called Eastern Center ACU board that the Pre 70 championship should be opened up to non British bikes. After all a M10 would be more period than the tricked Bantams and Cubs that fill up most of the entry. And I am sure a lot of people would like the opportunity to see one of these bikes being ridden. Stuart

As they say every day is a school day. Never come across this double numbering before. Stuart

As previously stated by Larry, the front wheel and forks and not original. Bit difficult to see from the video but the kickstart looks like a pattern part, the 199a should have a late type kickstart lever with a bolt above the spindle and these are fairly rare second hand. Levers are wrong but this is getting into a bit nick picking.Rear shocks again aftermarket but if working ok I would keep these as original Beta shocks can defiantly be improved upon. I could not make out the numbers from the video but the head stock appears to have two sets of numbers which rings alarm bells with me. Also as Larry I am not prepared to offer a suggestion as to value. But due to the wrong front forks and wheel and the double stamped head stock if it was me I would walk away unless relatively cheap. But jugging from the prices on ebay others may think different to me. Stuart

Bottom line, it is your bike do what you want. I would leave the loop in place but this is based on my opinion that they look better that way, Just my point of view. Stuart

I bought a flywheel holding tool from Sammy Miller probably about 35 years ago and it is still in perfect condition and been used on more engine rebuilds than I care to remember. Not sure of your location but the same tool I have is still available from Sammy Miller products here in the UK. (No connection just a happy customer after 35 years) http://www.smproducts.co.uk/products/tools?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.pbv.v9.tpl&product_id=729&category_id=27 Stuart

John, Sensible system but you can keep it. The UK system a bit complicated but would this thread be a bit boring if we had your system. Many bikes and cars identity is defined by the UK registration. Sammy's GOV132 would be another good example. (Both of them! and ignoring the previous bikes to carry the number) I own a 1935 BSA car. in the owners club we often refer to specific cars by the registration and this does not change when sold. The old registration also looks right on the vehicle In my example two letters and 4 numbers. I can also confirm that some offices were issuing the older 2 letter 4 number registrations long after other offices had moved over to 3 letters 3 numbers. Several posters have referred to the question was Sammy employed by Bultaco. Obviously the man him self could answer this but I seem to have read that at the time in question he was employed or at least had a contract with the Rickman brothers who had a workshop in New Milton not Bultaco and were at the time the official importers. Putting two and two together I think this would explain Sammy Miller moving from Birmingham to Hampshire about this time. I would also would not be surprised as to it being the Rickman brothers who registered the bike. Another point to bear in mind is that in the UK you do not need to be the owner of a bike or car to register it. You would be the registered keeper not necessarily the owner. Stuart.

I think it has been fairly well known for many years, well at least to me that the bike in the prominent museum was not the original. If you asked anything about it you would not get a straight answer. Stuart

Blutaco . I will sort out some photographs and send them to you. It will take me probably about a week to find the time to get the frames out of the shed and take the photo's. Could you PM me an email address to send theses to. I have to be honest with you my M10 frame is very rusty in this lower loop area and I am a bit concerned about it strength. This is why I have the model 16 frame as I intend doing a similar task as you propose. It is also why I have measured the two frames side by side. I started on my Model 10 project about 3 years ago but it has been side lined as I am working on restoring a BSA car, Hopefully will be back onto it next year. The model 49 frame will provide donor parts but I think they changed the size between the 4 speed and 5 speed engines so will need more work than a model 16 frame. When I take the photographs I will try a set of model 80 crank cases in to confirm my suspicions. Stuart/Twinnshock.

Where are you located. I am located in North Essex (UK) and have a Model 10 frame you could come and take measurements from. An actual model 10 frame is hens teeth but the lower loop from several other early models fitted with the 4 speed engine are similar if not identical so could easily be grafted in place by a competent welder. The first matador, model 16 frame is basically the same frame with additional webs.(this model was developed from the model 10) If you could get one of these frames they can easily be modified to model 10 standard. More than one model 10 has been rebuilt with a model 16 frame. I was told this by Dave Renham but I suspect actual owners will not be so forthcoming. I have a model 16 frame (not for sale) and I have measured it side by side with the model 10 and can confirm the main loop has the same geometry including head stock angle.If you are in the UK and able to visit you would be welcome to see the two frames side by side. In other words this is probably not as difficult as you might think. Please do it. Stuart

Interesting subject with as many opinions as posters. I have a couple of bikes with original chrome and these can be made to work fine and given a choice I would always prefer original chrome hubs. All my bikes have the pivot in the brake plate bushed to eliminate wear and I always set up and machine the shoes mounted on the brake plate in a lathe to give 100% contact area. Lining the brake drums is a way to save otherwise unusable hubs. I find interesting that we seem to have a debate regarding steel or cast iron. I also appreciate that many different grades of steel or iron are available. My own opinion is that cast iron is best. I appreciate the actual cast process must be a factor but you have to ask why most car drums and disc's are cast iron? I work as a designer (engines) for a major car manufacturer and must admit to taking a trawl through the drawing data base at drawings for drums and discs to see what grades were specified. I am still firmly in the cast iron camp. Stuart

Sorry, I work full time and all my spare time is currently being spent on my BSA restoration and the half complete bathroom my wife seems to want finished for some strange reason. Stuart

I have used both cast iron and steel. No sure what grade of steel I have used but it was a disaster and I would never waste my time again with steel. Despite trying different grades of brake liner material I just could not make it work, On the other hand my experience with cast iron has resulted in brilliant brakes. The front brake on my 199 easily works with just one finger. Newfren liners do not work well with cast iron to be honest in my opinion they seem not to work well with any material!. I use fork lift truck lining material bonded onto original shoes by a company in Yorkshire.(saftek) Cast iron is difficult to obtain in tube form. I buy a slice from a solid bar usually from College Engineering Supplies in Birmingham (UK) who will cut a blank to my exact width. Expensive but it least you can get it. I then drill a series of holes and cut or knock out the middle which goes in the scrap box for possible other jobs. Then onto the lathe. The first cuts are interesting as the jagged surface from the holes gives the tool and lathe a very hard time. It takes me a couple of hours to produce a blank for final machining but my time in the workshop in the evenings is cheep. Domestic oven in the kitchen to heat the hub prior to final assembly. After 30 years of marriage my wife is used to this and also finding cast iron rings in the freezer. Stuart

I have been looking at link from sectionone. I am thinking of ordering the Diesel version. Does anyone know if the engine management software for this bike is written by VW? Twinnshock

I picked up the frame of my M166 Alpina from the powder coating firm this morning. Spent the day starting the final build. Forks and rear shocks only fitted temporary as I still have to polish and paint these items. Mudguards are original and are stainless steel. Stuart

My apologies for going off subject but scot taco made the mistake of asking. My previous reply where I referred to my other project was a bit cryptic. The project is a 1935 BSA series 1 Scout. I have been told by more than 1 person that I must be mistaken as BSA did not make cars but when does fact get in the way of some peoples knowledge! The Scout was developed from the 3 wheeler and has a 1075cc water cooled 4 cylinder side valve engine. 3 speed gearbox (+reverse) and is more interestingly front wheel drive. It was built in the Small Heath motorcycle factory. Picture attached as bought and another taken earlier this year. The body is now back on and I am currently working on the wings etc. I promise next pictures will be of the Alpina M188 when I get the frame back. As this is planned for Long distance Trials use I think it is acceptable on this forum. First event will be the Braintree (Essex) MCC Long distance. I did not ride this event this year but the year before rode my M215 Frontera and it was a bit much for the event. Hoping the Alpina will be better suited. I am on the committee of the club so already getting told I must enter. Date not yet confirmed for 2016. Stuart

Just to get this thread back on track..................... Took the frame of my Alpina M188 to be Powder Coated today. On phone said it would be two week turn around but when dropping off frame they said they are very busy and it would be nearer 4 weeks! Never mind plenty of other tasks still to do. I am planning on using this bike to ride 3 long distance Trials next year so must be finished by February/March next year. Have to be honest this is not my main project on the go at the moment so 4 weeks is not a big issue. (main project originally built in Small Heath, Birmingham in 1935 but with four wheels not two) Stuart

As we apear to be digging out some old photo's I thought I would add a not quite action shot of my M80 in Scotland 2005 SSDT. This photo was taken on the Monday when spectating but had been used for back marking duties for that years Pre 65 event. And the other two of me on my M198. Stuart [

Anorak mode. Note at end states M27. Whilst I agee bike as discovered looks like a M27 the bike being riden had a radial head and more rounded tank so is more probabaly a M10. What an irresponsible bike rider scaring Horse and rider. I vote this should be banned Stuart