Villiers Engine Set Up

[daved444]

I know this might open up a complete bag of worms but here goes.....

The Sprite I am doing at the moment has a Villiers 32a engine with, I understand, a Parkinson Head and was once a 360cc. It has since been re-sleeved and is now back to standard bore as a 250 so other than the oversized cylinder head it appears to be a standard ally barrel.

The question is;

Which electronic ignition is the right way to go for trials? I have heard that numerous James, Greeves, Sprites, Francis Barnets, Saracens etc etc are running well on either Simon Bateman, Rax Caunt or PVL ignitions - can anyone point me in the right direction and advise the different characteristics that make one better than the other?

2nd Question - Which carb and what base settings should I go for.

Any advise is welcomed

Dave

[old trials fanatic]

Surprised you havent spoken to Alan about the ignition.

As for the carb it depends where you want to ride the bike? generally speaking an Amal concentric Mk1 is acceptabe at most events.

[totalshell]

you want a mk1 amal on your 32a, the needle lenghth is critical at about 47.5mm from memory, for ignition you can by off the shelf from greeves (epensive fiddly to set up accuarately but dependable and maintenace free from my experience or from rex caunt whose stuff i have not tried but comes reccommended by others i'm not aware thatpvl offer a two stroke ignition

[old trials fanatic]

Got a PVL on mine. Been using a 4 stroke version on the B40 for a year and very impressed. The 2 stroke version for the Villiers has received a glowing report from Mick Andrews when he tried a bike fitted with one so on that recommendation i bought one.

Villiers Services sell them i.r.o.

[daved444]

Surprised you havent spoken to Alan about the ignition.

As for the carb it depends where you want to ride the bike? generally speaking an Amal concentric Mk1 is acceptabe at most events.

I have spoken to Alan but have also spoken to a number of other people who appear to have very well sorted bikes and everyone claimes that theirs are the best.

Of course Alan promotes the PVL and quite rightly so for the cub as its the best thing out there but there are not many Villiers PVL's out there yet and Mick Andrews recommendation is highly regarded but there are a number of opinions and various prices for ignition systems.

The guys winning in the midlands appear be on Simon Bateman ignitions and claim to have no problems but I hear from other quarters that they auto retard and possibly dont rev out as well as some of the others.

The Rex Caunt ignitions are similar to PVL I understand but I dont know many people using them.

Regaring the Carb - I am looking fo fairly soft consistent delivery (read useable in mud and low grip) so any info on settings for the Amal concentric Mk1 are welcome.

Dave

[twinshockdude]

if you are a tight a***,like me,you can always fit an old motoplat,simon bateman supplied mine,very cheap

and has run for years with no problem,he also has a magic box for motoplat which gives some advance and retard,also very cheap!!!

[mickmetcalfe]

I have now used two different Simon Bateman ignitions:

My Greeves has a points based system with a new LT coil and a Japanese type HT coil on it that in use has never needed the points gap adjusting - something a standard Villiers set-up could only ever dream of doing. Before you say anything, I checked it after every ride!!!!

The Cotton has his latest electronic system and is now coming up for two years old. Ive had no problems with it at all. Mine didnt completely rev out at first but I adjusted the timing a little and its now very good, although I have to add I ride on lows revs where ever possible.

Both systems are very reliable and represent good value for money.

Although I dont have a note with me of the settings I use for AMAL mk1 carbs, if you buy one jetted for a Greeves Anglian, then it will be quite a close starting point. Ive done this with half a dozen different engines so far and only ever needed to go one step on any jet. I have bought from both Surrey Cycles and Sammy Miller.

While its risking an avalance of comment, I think that there is a lot of myth and legend surrounding what parts you need for a decent Villiers engine. Mine are painfully standard compared with some but Ive still had a lot of success on them. I genuinely believe if you put them together carefully and ask Simon for advice where required, then you wont go far wrong.

[daved444]

Thanks for the info Mick.

To be honest I think you are right - I had a ride on Mick Parkes' saracen at the weekend and the engine was beautiful - he runs it with a motoplat ignition and wins BMCA trials most weekends. If I can get the engine running something like that I will be well chuffed.

Dave

[woody]

Yes I'd agree. you don't need an extensively modded engine to make it run well. Decent airbox and exhaust with a reliable and efficient ignition and it will do all it needs to. Tried one a couple of years ago and it had all the power needed for classic events.