Unauthorised Riders Ssdt & Pre 65

[mattp]

Andy, As we are again nearing the time when thoughts are heading to Fortwilliam and Kinlochleven area ,it must be a good time

to start the NO NUMPTIE CAMPAIN. against unautherised riders for the six days and pre 65.

I am sure the organising club would be pleased for any help that T/C can give to stop the riders/spectators who still ignore warnings.

Will you post photos ect.this year.

[slapshot 3]

Andy, As we are again nearing the time when thoughts are heading to Fort William and Kinlochleven area ,it must be a good time

to start the NO NUMPTIE CAMPAIGN. against unauthorised riders for the six days and pre 65.

I am sure the organising club would be pleased for any help that T/C can give to stop the riders/spectators who still ignore warnings.

Will you post photos ect.this year.

Shocking indictment for Ayrshire schools Uncle Matt, which one did you go to..... I've sorted your spelling and grammar.

Fully agree though anything that can be done to sort the Muppets out helps protect both trials.

[Andy]

BTW, for those have no idea what this is about I ran this article on Trials Central last year.

In answer to the original poster's question the "naming and shaming" will be far harder this year, but I will be doing a fair bit of discouragement beforehand in the hope some might listen. It would be nice to see no photos and no need to run this kind of story, but if needs be then I have no qualms about it. These people are selfish fools.

[slapshot 3]

BTW, for those have no idea what this is about I ran this article on Trials Central last year.

In answer to the original poster's question the "naming and shaming" will be far harder this year, but I will be doing a fair bit of discouragement beforehand in the hope some might listen. It would be nice to see no photos and no need to run this kind of story, but if needs be then I have no qualms about it. These people are selfish fools.

Pity you couldn't have held on to the comments maybe make a few more people understand what it was all about!!!!

[gizza5]

It would be nice to see no photos and no need to run this kind of story, but if needs be then I have no qualms about it. These people are selfish fools.

Andy don't sit on the fence like our Lilly Livered Prime Minister who won't go and get our boys and girl out of Iran

Name, shame take photo's and post them, I will take a good look at the photo's from last year and see if the same ''Muppets'' do the same this year

[Andy]

Pity you couldn't have held on to the comments maybe make a few more people understand what it was all about!!!!

You may not be able to see the comments any more, but that doesn't mean to say I can't

Again in explanation for those not around when the article was posted, I used to have the facility on Trials Central where people could add comments to news articles. Unfortunately this had to be removed due to abuse, but the comments still exist in the database.

What follows is the comments that were posted to the "muppets" article detailed above. You need to start from the bottom and work your way up to follow the train as that's how they were presented. It makes interesting reading. Didn't make me change my mind, but makes interesting reading anyway. All are posted as they were originally and are totally unedited. All I've done is go through the comments and make the headings bold so they're easier to follow:

Comments to article

Bigfoot wrote on 16.05.2006:

I agree with the majority is that you just shouldn't be there if you aren't a registered rider or official of some sort. I've watched the SSDT for many years and never thought about taking my bike off road to the sections. Many of the best sections are easily accessable from the road after a short and pleasant walk.

I'm not sure the police or clamping is a real starter. Clamping is not legal in scotland as far as I know and the police cannot easily get involved unless the land owner complains about damage to his/her property.

2fargone wrote on 14.05.2006:

Hi all,

nobody can or should expect the organisers to do anymore than they allready do, the notice on the gate should be suffice.The problem is pure simply ignorance on the part of the so called 'muppets'and the only way this can be overcome is by education, maybe a full page in the front of the programme warning them of the extreme consequences this irresponsible behaviour will ultimately have on these historic events.Alternatively let them all ride up to pipeline in their droves just don't let them out because if I remember correctly there only is one way out.

On a slightly lighter note if all else fails, try all new 'CILLIT BANG' it removes everything according to that noisy bugger on the telly!

Scorpa3 wrote on 13.05.2006:

I believe that Police involvement is the only realistic and (more importantly) safe way forward.

Any private person taking action would be likely to break the law themselves.

Plus, you never know who you are stopping or messing with; there are some very nasty people out there.

Leave it to those who are paid to do the job.

Slapshot 3 wrote on 13.05.2006:

Hi Atomant,

The police are present at these two events every year but purely in traffic control mode.Don't know what it would take to get them to do more and would it cost the organisers more money.

Additionally, there are some technical differences in Land Use and legistlation in England and Scotland, may not be that straightforward. Hopefully it is, would sort out the muppts really quickly

Atomant wrote on 13.05.2006:

I have just spent some time researching current legislation and I have found out that the police under the police Reform Act, now have new powers to seize motor vehicles used illegally and either impose heavy fines or send the machines to the crusher!

What would it take to get some police presence at the event?

HL wrote on 12.05.2006:

Like the clamping idea Totalshell...not sure how many clamping companies would trail out to Guanach Gorge mind you!!!

Stopping sections is definitely no-go as far as the SSDT is concerned - apart from anything else, riders head off at one-minute intervals, and before you know it you'd have a pile up of 270 riders sitting at the bottom of the section waiting for our Russell to stop spouting rubbish and move his bike!

The other thing to bear in mind with all of this is that all the observers you see throughout the week are giving up their own time and money to stand out on the hill for eight hours a day as it is - they're not going to want to drag their day out for any longer than they have to, and we're not going to ask them to. We're eternally grateful to them for doing what they do and there's no way we're going to risk losing observers by putting them through that.

If the guys causing all the problems took some time out to do a bit of organising rather than hindering, they'd get some idea of the huge effort involved in pulling trials together, and I'm just talking club trials, never mind something on the scale of the SSDT. Maybe then they'd think twice about jeopardising it for ever.

Andy wrote on 12.05.2006:

Russell - I fail to see how you can turn this against me. I VERY rarely express personal opinion on this site, but when I do it's because something has sufficiently upset or angered me enough to do so. Absolutely, it was a fantastic weekend (as I said), Great Trial (as I said), great weather (as I said) and in an awesome location. It was only spoiled by guys like you blatantly ignoring the requests of the organisers. I really don't see that as me putting a downer on an otherwise great event. I see that as YOU and your kind putting a downer on an otherwise great event.

Ask the organisers of the Pre-65, the SSDT or ANY Trial. Do they want my sort of person who respects the rules of the event or do they want your sort with the "Sod the rules and requests, I'll do what I want regardless of the consequences" attitude. I think I may just come out on top on that one...

totalshell wrote on 12.05.2006:

the p65 was not alone in having these people in attendance on the ssdt i saw mini bikes been ridden up to chairlift! as well as a fair number of pukka endoro bikes this on the west highland way which was busy with walkers as well as trials followers, here we have an opportunity to mix with and impress 'the enemy' a great many of who stopped to watch at chairlift and some even went out of thier way to get off the beaten track to get to ba house and what do some of the trials communiyt do? everything that were ever accused of ride scramblers illegally off road, ride bikes with knobbly tyres illegally on a footpath..

back to how to stop it..

two simple 100% affective ways..

1. chain up each bike not authorised to be on private land with a 25 quid release fee ( many clamping firms would be happy of the chance of ' aholiday in the highlands'

2 same as in rallying a course opening bike and riding marshalls have the power to stop a section until the offending bikes are removed

the greatest distance i walked across country was to the last sections on thursday no bikes there, big hairy bloke at entrance saying 'no bike up here mate' worked a treat..

Atomant wrote on 12.05.2006:

The one major serious consequence of riding illegally at this event is if you have an accident. You have no insurance cover; the event insurance will not cover you and you will be subject to being sued. If you were to seriously injure somebody then it would be classed as a criminal offence and subject to a custodial sentence. Why would you want to risk that?

Also, as an organiser (albeit on a smaller scale) the hours of effort that these people put in at their expense in time & money for the enjoyment of others warrants some respect from the biking community surely. A simple request to leave the bike at the gate is respected by the majority but disrespected by the few and these few could spoil it for everyone! Please just leave the bike at the gate and walk!

Slapshot 3 wrote on 12.05.2006:

Russell,

you are right we have not thanked the organisers of the trials on here. I was there, I did it personally, face to face, people tend to appreciate it more that way.

Your criticism of Andy would be warranted had you not flouted the rules requested by the trial organisers. No-one I spoke to either had a bad word to say about the events, except how disappointed they were that some people thought they were above rules and could ride their bikes wherever they wanted to....

The police should not have to get involved but what do you do, you ask nicely year on year but get ignored, eventually you get hacked off and look for a stronger way of dealing with the problem....Shotgun anyone!!! As for the throttle cables, well you know nothing else has worked maybe having to push your bike a few miles might make you think twice.

The event Steward who was handing out the laminated notices on behalf of the club had his hands tied as well, what can they do, take away a competition license might be an approach but it wouldn't stop you in Fort William or Kinlochleven.

There is no point you coming on here looking to explain yourself,to give out excuses, pass the buck or seek justification. You broke the rules, you had the balls to admit it (respect for that)but it changes nothing you broke the rules and you have shown no remorse, accept it and take your medicine like a man.

Scorpa3 wrote on 12.05.2006:

It is deplorable that spectators choose to ignore the official requests from the organisers not to ride in certain areas.

However I would be most reluctant to approach these people in any sort of official capacity.

I believe the only way to deal with this illegal riding is to take registration details of the machines and pass it onto the Police.

Approaching a complete stranger/strangers in the street can be dangerous, never mind in the middle of a deserted trail miles from no-where.

Is it worth getting a smack in the mouth for? Or worse?

Russell wrote on 12.05.2006:

I

[gizza5]

That made interesting reading, wonder if ''Russell the Muppet'' has read this and is prepared to reply.

Seems he is inteligent enough with the Queens English, but chooses not to obey the rules.

Come on Russell be brave and post your first ever post, it's been a year. Do you think it is still Ok to take your moped round the course?

We will be gentle with our replies

[Andy]

That made interesting reading, wonder if ''Russell the Muppet'' has read this and is prepared to reply.

Seems he is inteligent enough with the Queens English, but chooses not to obey the rules.

Come on Russell be brave and post your first ever post, it's been a year. Do you think it is still Ok to take your moped round the course?

We will be gentle with our replies

To be honest, I admired Russell for having the balls to stand up and be counted. I thought his argument was totally worthless, but admired him nonetheless for owning up.

Having re-read the whole thing with almost a year gone by it's brought it to the forefront again. A publicity campaign will begin shortly

[old trials fanatic]

Hmmm interesting reading. I've never been to the Scottish before so this year will be my first time. Before i get lynched i wont be taking any of my bikes OK.

Now perhaps because i have never been before i find it hard to understand the foracity of some of the remarks above. I'm beginning to wonder if i ought to pack a baseball bat as the "locals" sound rather aggressive towards "strangers". OK i am not party to the history, i assume there must have been some nastyness in the past, but i always thought the Scottish and especially the Pre65 was going to be a holiday and a chance to see the best bikes and riders in a fantastic atmospheric setting. It's starting to sound more like a weekend in Baghdad.

Seriously after reading the above i'm beginning to wonder if it's worth spending the money on going.

Is it really that unfriendly with Trials rider turning against fellow Trials rider?

[slapshot 3]

Pity you couldn't have held on to the comments maybe make a few more people understand what it was all about!!!!

You may not be able to see the comments any more, but that doesn't mean to say I can't

Knew it just needed a prompt I remember it well, those happy days.

The guy did have balls for coming back on here and standing up like he did.......how many days....

[highland lassie]

Is it really that unfriendly with Trials rider turning against fellow Trials rider?

Absolutely and utterly not. It's a brilliant weekend, followed by a brilliant week, and it's worth every last penny. The atmosphere is fantastic - it's really something you can't put into words, so don't let anything put you off. You'll love it.

[Andy]

Is it really that unfriendly with Trials rider turning against fellow Trials rider?

Absolutely not. The Pre-65 is a fantastic weekend in an awesome location. It is not Trials rider turning against fellow Trials rider. It's the REAL supporters of Trials who wants to see it continue turning against the selfish muppets who think they can ride what they want, where they want, when they want. These muppets may think they are fans and supporters of Trials, but all they are actually doing is helping to kill the sport by ignoring the rules and jeapordising the future of what are classic events in the Trials calendar with their "I'm alright Jack" attitude.

As you can probably tell this topic hit a sweet spot with me. I took the bait , but both the Pre-65 and SSDT are at serious risk if we don't do what we can to protect them.

I've said enough - for now

[axulsuv]

From the other side of the pond ; All I can truly say is that the " enthusiast spectators "(muppets) , Must wake up and understand that they are

risking the end of the holy grail of trials with their lazy selfish actions . Report them , have law at the trail heads if need be , Whatever it takes !

I haven't had the chance to even see the ssdt., and I really want to .!!! There is no Finer , richer history filled event on the planet to the best

of my limited knowledge ! It is one of (or the ) oldest organized motorcycle competitions still happening ...

Would pitchforks be allowed ?