Acu Give Youth A Raw Deal

[ysb]

As been involved with Trials from every angle, Rider, minder, parent, organizer. coc, sponser, plus anything else the sport needs. I sit here reading the list of national date provided by the ACU to our club Scarborough and District Motor Club, we at sdmc have been about for a long time, 104 years same as the acu.

We at SDMC have run youth nat trials from the start of the youth movment approx 20 years or so? running A & B and C&D Championship events, often alternat years but sometimes c&d on the sat and a&b on the sun this we have done to help out our trusted ACU, But not anymore our annual date of April is no more , we were offerd a feb date which we did take only to be told we could not run then either, we have beed offerd a date in sept which we can not do, so no youth Nat at Scarborough Thanks ACU Sorry you Youth Riders.

To Add insult to ingury, The Scarborough Youth 2 Day Trial, this is the only Youth only 2 day trial in the country and has been run for over 20 years on the 1st weekend in Aug, past riders include all the Lampkins, Hemmingways, Mark Colmer, David Cobos, infact any rider who rode as a youth would have proberly rode this event, still now after 25 years we still regulary get 100 youth riders, over the last few years we have been without the top 5 or so A class riders who have opted to ride in the Adult B,C in the support class, this we can handle infact sometimes it made a better trial for the nmot so good rides.

But for 2008 our Trusty ACU are having a Youth C&D Round on the 1st sat in Aug at Kent so without these riders we feel its not worth running

The Point i am making is Are the T&E Committe so far out of touch with the youth scene that they could kill it off all together or should us youth supporting clubs throw the towell in and maybe go YMSA.

Well thats my moan over i am well p***ed of with the Acu what are your Thoughts

PS Sorry about the spelling

[sutty]

well i agree with you it makes you wonder sometimes why we bother at all with the acu other clubs do quite well without them and after all we are keeping the fat cats at rugby in a job with all are revenue after all when was the last time there was a big claim from trials or out going towards trials ive said i9t before one half doesnt know what the other half is doing they need to be more intouch with people like yourselfs who have brought these riders on in the sport its discraceful what they have done to your events i wouldnt be surprised if there is someone involved in the other events who is high up in the t&e commitie this should upset the acu camp GOOD !!!!!

[tomsdad]

My lads have ridden several Youth nationals run at Lowe North Park over the past 5 years and more than one Youth Two Day Trial.

Every one has been a pleasure to attend. The organisation is spot on, the variety of sections is supurb, the level of difficulty is always just right and the kids have a whale of a time.

Reading some of the other threads on here it appears that the Youth A & B dates have been an almighty cock up for 2008. With all the other events now in the calender for 2008, it would seem that the A & B Nationals are going to have to be squeezed in as an after thought, rather than taking their correct position in the pecking order.

If the Scarborough club becomes an innocent victim of a blunder by the ACU then your frustration is quite justified.

Let's hope that you do get the dates you need and we can enjoy another trip to Lowe North Park in 2008.

Mike.

[agiow]

YSB don

[john collins]

Lost half my post so will start again:

Oh what fantastic stuff.

At least two - possibly three guys who profess to be

Edited October 22, 2007 by John Collins

[ysb]

Nice Reply John

1st we feel we have interests in both Riders and our Club ( Trials as a whole )

i also understand that the Top youth rider want to ride alongside the adults in the adult B C

But the whole youth calender should not be run by 5 or so riders who may or may not ride these trials,

plus they can only ride the expert course so how much can they learn from that,

Big events as you call them and rightly so, The Scarboro 2 day Youth Trial is a Big event in the youth calender , AND as the T&E Committee are so in touch with the youth scene surley they all know when this is

so why a C&D Champ on this date ?

Edited October 22, 2007 by YSB

[bumpy]

they can only ride the expert course so how much can they learn from that,

You're absolutely right, what can riders aged between 13-18 learn from riders in the expert class with riders like Baker, Danby, Thorpe, Vesterinen, Pearson (this years top 5) plus past winners sam haslam, james lampkin, andy huddlestone, darren brice, david knight plus other riders like alexz wigg, lee sampson, shaun morris, michael brown.....do i need to continue? I do believe some of those riders are also ACU coach's. Sorry to be a bit blunt but i think you were out of line there.

The fact is that the acu do have problems with fixtures and i do sympathsise with you but im sure a compromise can be reached. If it comes down to a clash with an adult british champs round then it should not be a problem as it is an ADULT brit champs round and youth can only ride as guests anyway.

Good luck in sorting this out. Scarboro youth trials are a big part in our top riders history so it would be a massive shame if you decided to not run your event.

[ysb]

Hi Bumpy

i was not suggesting that youth riders could not learn anything from other riders as we all know they can,

but having 5 or so youth riders in the BC riding the expert course, is not the be all and end all, these riders

as we know all set of 1st in the trial so are often section scrubbers for the rest, so i think if they want the experiance of riding these events then good let them ride, But the whole youth callender should not revolve

round this which is what seems to be happening,

i do also know that sorting dates must be a mare for the ACU, maybe by adopting the system of not having youth and adult nats on the same day has gone one step to far and made thier problems to great

Edited October 22, 2007 by YSB

[john collins]

You may well be correct YSB - in your point that the Youth calendar should not be unduly influenced by clashes with Brit Champ - as only the top 5 riders ride this in any case.

I suppose you could then also apply this to perhaps World rounds - and perhaps UEM rounds - when sometimes perhaps only a small number compete

I cannot give a better example than in Enduro ( not Youth example - but principle same) - where again we try to keep Brit Champ away from World Champ - and this makes dates very difficult. I think in some events in 07 - we were down to 1 or 2 riders in World Champ.

However - that is the principle that was set - and asked for by Youth riders/parents. Surely everyone can see that this makes life much more difficult for us - and if we just put in dates regardless - majority of Clubs would be happy - and we would certainly suffer less criticism - but we are trying to do what we have been asked to do - by those involved - this is why I get frustrated.

Now - sooner or later - we all have to decide about whether this policy of keeping Brit Adult dates clear - when drawing up Youth Champ needs to be maintained -

Reading many posts - I have to say that the impression I get is that we do. I could be wrong - but it does appear that the top 5 youth feel they gain a lot when they are allowed to compete in Brit Champ - on Expert sections.

If the view is that they are not gaining a lot - and it is not worth restricting calendar for - then we can change it

- Perhaps we need to hear more from these top riders or their parents/ associates?

I have already said - I think it is important - as I think it allows those top 5 a stepping stone in Europe/World - but I am fairly open minded on this issue - so it is certainly open for more debate.

Please all be aware however that although the calendar is difficult - it is far from impossible - and there are enough dates - the real problem is that because of land issues/ local events/ tradition etc etc Clubs cannot fit in with the available dates.

This happens in my own club for our own Brit Champ - and in recent years it has tended to be the ACU sends out a specific list of what dates are available to run Adult Brit Champ ( taking into account FIM/World etc) - and usually there are about 8 available dates - and perhaps we require say 7 -8 rounds - so basically it is " who wants/can run a round on these dates - if not I am afraid there is no alternative - and unfortunately you will not be able to run this particular year" Even this is difficult - as often 2 clubs opt for the same date!

Perhaps this is the way forward for 2009 - we set specific dates and then see who wants them. Seems a bit heavy handed to me - and we certainly already have emails from people who this year were not successful in getting a Youth A & B round pointing out that it seems to be the same clubs getting a round each year - fair point probably - but it is a fact that if a new club get a round in a particular year - and existing one loses a round - and the problem begins.

It seems most clubs - certainly my own - believe that the rounds of any particular Champ should rotate - until it comes down to them losing out - and then not happy - but I digress.

Now - to return to calendar - The problem we are trying to solve at present is Youth A & B. No new dates have been allocated - including S/borough - only suggestions have been made - in hope of finding a quick solution - this will continue all week (and probably result in many hours of work)

When we are putting dates in provisionally - we obviously consider the ones I have mentioned Brit Champ/UEM/FIM - and then look for spaces. We do try to take heed of the other National dates - and if possible try to work with these - but if the principle is that no Brit Champ round can be placed on a date that not only has a Brit Champ/UEM/FIM round on it

[adsy]

I cannot see why it is a problem running a A +B youth round on the same day as a world round!

maybe the Irish round, but the others?

[john collins]

The problem is Adsy - if we have Youth ridrs competing in it.

This would mean that a Youth rider would have to decide that if he wished to contest the World or European Championship - he would have to sacrifice the British Youth Championship. Surely this cannot be good?

Also of course - his sponsors etc may be very keen for him to win Brit Youth Champ - as this is where they sell their bikes - because he/ she has the desire/bottle/dedication to contest World/UEM - surley we should make him chose?

[adsy]

John,

the number of youth riders that are eligable / good enough to contest a whole series of world rounds are few.

Would it not be sense to contact these few riders directly to find out there intentions next year, rather than potentially damaging a whole domestic series, because a few riders 'might' want to ride a world round?

Only a thought.

[john collins]

Fair point - and we can have a lok at this - although we are fairly sure some will.

Biggest problem is that many are still working out deals/sponsorship ( parents money) etc and in Oct 07 can not be sure of where they stand - and also some do early rounds - and only progress if results follow for example.

I suspect ( from experince of U23 Enduro lads) that intentions/reality may be a bit apart in October - and this is of course the time we have to do calendar.

But it should be possible to get some idea - and we will see what we can do or find out

[perce]

I think RMC would very much liked to have run another A & B National, one or two of us weren't that happy we we not offered one in 2007 after the first class critical review we received from the riders in 2006 but one was still applied for in 2008. The whole problem though is the congestion of the calendar, our diary & that of the ACU simply doesn't match. It's a big shame as we have a first class venue & a fair bit of experience at running proper Trials.

[nigel dabster]

John,

the number of youth riders that are eligable / good enough to contest a whole series of world rounds are few.

Would it not be sense to contact these few riders directly to find out there intentions next year, rather than potentially damaging a whole domestic series, because a few riders 'might' want to ride a world round?

Only a thought.

Would jack not be bothered if he couldn't contest the A class?

I can't think there is anyone else it would affect? If this is the case then the argument for avoiding A & B clashing with FIM is negated.

UEM & FIM may be different, but Norway wouldn't be on everyones list to do anyhow.

Also isn't the April date you mentioned the USA who does that clash with in the youth Challoner? No one else?

Edited October 22, 2007 by Nigel Dabster