zerodog Posted November 14, 2008 Report Share Posted November 14, 2008 Here is the deal. 06 4rt 65hrs on it. If the bike sits for a week it is pretty tough to start. Once started it runs great. Then it will start will little trouble after it is warmed up. Here is what I have looked at so far. Spark Plugs - new ones do not help Throttle cable- clean lubed and loose. Checked valve lash- In spec Fuel pump- Tested with 12vdc and it pumps instantly Spark- Seems to need a very hard kick to spark at all when testing. If I kick softly or slowly, nothing at all. So I think I have some weak component of the ignition. Bad coil? I have looked in the book and it says to test the Primary coil. I did that and it checks out good. And it also says in the same section to check the secondary coil. But it doesn't say what or where that is. What is it? Any ideas will help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the addict Posted November 14, 2008 Report Share Posted November 14, 2008 (edited) Make sure you check the tick-over is at least 1850rpm and you have free play in the throttle cable,dont touch the throttle when you start it at all and leave it on tickover until the fan kicks in. Edited November 14, 2008 by The Addict Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davyb Posted November 14, 2008 Report Share Posted November 14, 2008 This might sound daft but i had this with my 4rt,i adjusted the tick over up by the screw under the seat unit anti clockwise seemed to make a world of difference.Give it ago see what happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hillary Posted November 14, 2008 Report Share Posted November 14, 2008 Yeah, a slow tickover will make it considerably more difficult to start. They don't have a reputation for being difficult to start so turn the tick over up and it's likely to cure any problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shnaft Posted November 14, 2008 Report Share Posted November 14, 2008 Hi mate,ive got the same problem as you ,i have done all the tests to and just found out tonight how to test the secondary coil. put one lead on the terminal and the other lead at the ht lead,i will check mine tomorrow can any one confirm with the plug out you need a hard kick to get a spark cause mine is the same i was going to change the ht lead and cap and see what happens,i tried turning up the tick over but did not make any difference Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyl Posted November 15, 2008 Report Share Posted November 15, 2008 tick over is critical as due to no battery the fuel injection relies on capacity for charging. Low tick over means that this is not getting enough charge. Always stop the bike with the stop button, and press the stop before trying to start, flick the throttle open and shut prior to pushing stop button. This resets ecu. Still no joy try 2 very long slow kicks with the throttle wide open not trying to start the bike, snap throttle shut, press stop button and then try to start. Also I have found that when putting a clean air filter in with spray filter oil on the bike is a pig to start, the solvent off the filter oil must cock up the air flow meter in the throttle body. Make sure this is not the case or maybe you are spraying WD40 or something in and around the air box. A 4rt should always start within a couple of steady kicks -throttle closed mind. Hope some of that helps as Honda bits are normally pretty reliable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyevans Posted November 15, 2008 Report Share Posted November 15, 2008 QUOTE "flick the throttle open and shut prior to pushing stop button. This resets ecu." NO IT DOES NOT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b40rt Posted November 15, 2008 Report Share Posted November 15, 2008 All in the name of progress ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the addict Posted November 15, 2008 Report Share Posted November 15, 2008 Ralph had abit of a nightmare starting his 07 4rt just before a trial recently, he kicked the bike over the night before to make sure his spanner work had been ok and killed the engine before the fan kicked in .Next morning no amount of kicking or new plugs would fire her up, thankfully a rider nearby told him to hold the throttle wide open, push the kickstart down slowly three times then kick it over, fired first go not sure why but expect it reset something Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zerodog Posted November 15, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2008 Hi mate,ive got the same problem as you ,i have done all the tests to and just found out tonight how to test the secondary coil.put one lead on the terminal and the other lead at the ht lead,i will check mine tomorrow can any one confirm with the plug out you need a hard kick to get a spark cause mine is the same i was going to change the ht lead and cap and see what happens,i tried turning up the tick over but did not make any difference Let me know what you find. What do you mean HT lead? Do you mean the plug wire? So you are saying measure from one of the primary terminals to the plug wire? I have tried the tickover thing. In the past this has gotten it started but the bike is screaming. Probably 2500rpm or more. I do have a pretty fast idle going. And this does help. But does not cure this problem at all. And the reset is key to know just in general. It helps if it doesn't start on the 2nd or 3rd kick at any point. But again....... doesn't solve my starting problem after sitting for a while. Can one of you guys try kicking it and watching the spark on your bikes? And notice how hard you need to kick to get spark and at what point does it spark? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the addict Posted November 15, 2008 Report Share Posted November 15, 2008 (edited) Try a new plug cap if you havent already, or disconnect the kill switch and see if its better then Edited November 15, 2008 by The Addict Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shnaft Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 Let me know what you find.What do you mean HT lead? Do you mean the plug wire? So you are saying measure from one of the primary terminals to the plug wire? I have tried the tickover thing. In the past this has gotten it started but the bike is screaming. Probably 2500rpm or more. I do have a pretty fast idle going. And this does help. But does not cure this problem at all. And the reset is key to know just in general. It helps if it doesn't start on the 2nd or 3rd kick at any point. But again....... doesn't solve my starting problem after sitting for a while. Can one of you guys try kicking it and watching the spark on your bikes? And notice how hard you need to kick to get spark and at what point does it spark? Thats right mate any terminal at coil stick the other in the plug cap All the checks were ok apart fron the test on the alternator coil which should be 0.7 to 1, and i get 1.4,but i get 14.4 volts at tickover so spot on. I plan on going out with it today so will see what hapens,yesterday took 6 kicks from cold then started 1st kick all day,let me now how you get on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fantic303 Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 Hi, Spark is always weak when removed from head. Be sure that the throttle is REALY CLOSED when you try to start, leave the throttle closed while starting do not open it. when you push down the kickstarter do it slowly not the way you should do as with a 2 stroke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hop blip and a jump Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 (edited) Is the throttle position sensor adjustable??? (turns on a pivot and locked in position with a screw or bolt) It is on my fuel injected quad and if it moves it is hard to or wont start!!!! i have to set mine with a multimeter. Edited November 16, 2008 by hop blip and a jump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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