toofasttim Posted October 25, 2004 Report Share Posted October 25, 2004 I know of at least 3 short stroke works Honda still around (Mick Grants included), but does anybody know if any long stroke works Honda are still in existance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattylad Posted October 25, 2004 Report Share Posted October 25, 2004 I know of two genuine ex miller in France, recently there was one on ebay from a batch of I think 5 which Mick Grant had built into Jim Susans frames. If anybody wants to sell one.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toofasttim Posted October 25, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 25, 2004 John, I knew that Honda (Yam, Suz and Kaw) crush their works bikes (philistines!) but some escape the crusher. Pity Granty sold his. The other short strokes I know about are the one in Belgium that won a classic show this year and the one that Lane tested. Matty, would you please elaborate on the Jim Susan frames? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted October 25, 2004 Report Share Posted October 25, 2004 Matty, would you please elaborate on the Jim Susan frames? Well, I'm no expert on this subject but this is what I know, or more accurately, have been told over the years. There were 4 replica frames made by Jim Susans. These were of the old 306 Hondas as ridden by Miller, Shepherd, Jeffries, Higgins and Co. At some stage, four original works engines and exhausts were made available by Honda and built into the frames, presumably after Honda pulled the plug on its trials effort, by which time the works boys were on the 360. Exact replica tank and seat units were fitted which included the sculptered cut-out in the underside to clear the camshaft cover. They may even have been from the original batch made for the works bikes, don't know. Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toofasttim Posted October 25, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 25, 2004 There were 4 replica frames made by Jim Susans. These were of the old 306 Hondas as ridden by Miller, Shepherd, Jeffries, Higgins and Co. Woody, Thanks for a really comprehensive reply but don't you mean 310 (long strokes) in the quote, the 306 and 360 were the short and very short strokes respectively <G>. Big John (BJ sounds vaguely sordid!), have you still got the URL for the frame on which you were bidding? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted October 25, 2004 Report Share Posted October 25, 2004 Woody, Thanks for a really comprehensive reply but don't you mean 310 (long strokes) in the quote, the 306 and 360 were the short and very short strokes respectively <G>. Not sure now - I thought they did a 306 long and short stroke - I'm gonna have to consult my book now and have a look. PS - It was a complete replica bike that was on e-bay, not just a frame. Don't think you can see it now as it is long gone but you never know if Big John still has the URL or e-bay item number. I don't unfortunately. I've a picture of Shepherd's 360 somewhere which is pretty similar in looks to the 306. If I can find it I'll post it later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g4321 Posted October 25, 2004 Report Share Posted October 25, 2004 (edited) Does this mean you have the bike home now John? I will ensure my clothes are clean and I dont fall off too hard when i come round for that test ride you promised me! Is that a set of TLR forks or just similar? Can We see a photo from the exhaust side? Gordon Edited October 25, 2004 by g4321 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted October 25, 2004 Report Share Posted October 25, 2004 Do you mean this little baby, I actually got it after all! I certainly do - Nice buy Big John, I'm not at all jealous I thought it had sold to someone else. Now if you'd care to sponsor me on it in the Classic series I wouldn't have to worry about all those 'what if's' that stopped me bidding on it - oh ok, and the fact that I knew I would be outbid anyway Tim - the 306, or 305 (as it seems to be referred to as either) came in both long-stroke and short-stroke. The long stroke was the original, specced by Miller and based on a stroked version of the TL250 motor I believe, such as that in Big John's bike. The short stroke was a new motor built by HRC with completely different bore and stroke making it very short in height physically and oversquare. The 360 evolved from this short-stroke motor and they achieved the 360cc by lengthening the stroke. The 306 short-stroke and the 360 differ in appearance from the long-stroke, most easily recognisable by the high gear lever position. Now I'm no expert on trials Hondas but this is correct to the best of my knowledge. Attached picture is of Shepherd's 360 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g4321 Posted October 25, 2004 Report Share Posted October 25, 2004 Nice bike John I was interested in the exhaust side to see the size & shape of exhaust - if there was a 'front silencer' as well as the main silencer & there is - a nice big volume which should = loads of torque low down. P{ity it will make it very quiet though. There cant be much airbox volume? Gordon I take it you will not be competing on the Alvie rocks this weekend with this Honda? See you Sunday - lets hope the weather is DRY & the sections are P65/TS friendly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subira Posted October 25, 2004 Report Share Posted October 25, 2004 Did you get any history with the bike ? I'm wondering when they were built, I packed up in '85 and don't remember seeing any. I was handicapped by having a home built SL/TL125 as my first bike in '77ish, and followed the Honda's ever since (hence the Montesa weakness). I remember there only being a few TL250s ever imported into the UK. Which would make this a very rare machine, even though its a 'replica'. Jim used to live quite close to me in Buckinghamshire, he made a few 'works' Bultaco air boxes for Commerfords from what I remember, plus of course ran a few tidy Ariels. He's still occassionally seen on a C15 (immaculate of course) at local trials. There's a few interesting bikes that pass through eBay, but none as tidy as that Honda ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toofasttim Posted October 25, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 25, 2004 BAR STEWARD. Jeez BJ that's beautiful..Will post tomorow, when "feeling better". TFT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toofasttim Posted October 27, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 27, 2004 Nausea abated. Big John, I think it's time for you to supply us who are affected by terminal jealousy with an inventory of your collection, as well a your address and and any serious allergies and/or health problems that may aid in a premature demise Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vintagecota Posted October 30, 2004 Report Share Posted October 30, 2004 I normally consider Hondas to be rather pedestrian fare, but those ones look like cracking pieces of kit. p.s. We don't normally talk like this in Canader. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toofasttim Posted October 31, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2004 Having said that, eldest (No. 1 Son) has developed similar symptoms (he asked if I could buy him a 125 Bultaco Sherpa to do twinshock riding) as he is only 15. One like this Big John? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toofasttim Posted November 1, 2004 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Cute ain't it? What about the 175 Sherpa? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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