Will It Be Competitive?

[johnnyboxer]

A bit of advice or your views needed

I have a 1982 Godden framed Majesty 175, which I fancy riding in a Twinshock classes at club Trials and maybe progressing further if I like it or my results are good enough.

The bike is mechanically very sound and everything works fine,with all maintenance up to date with everything replaced as necessary.

I've never trialled it, just ridden a few times at a practice ground.

Cosmetically it's pretty good also with all the correct Majesty modifications and parts,the wheels were already respoked and fitted with new rims,plus IRC tubed tyres.

It has a SM chromed front pipe (which some say produces more torque.......does it?) and new Falcon gas shocks.

Can I improve the forks..........they seem a bit weedy !!!

Maybe fit TY250 twinshock forks and yokes or a TY250 mono front end.

Would the swap be worth it?

Will it have enough power for an adult 15 st frame?

I'm sure I will enjoy riding it in a few events............but am I looking at through 'rose-coloured' specs?

I have a TLR200 also.............should I concentrate my efforts on riding/improving this and thus consign the Majesty to the back of the garage as a historical relic, only to ride for pleasure occasionally at the practice ground.

Edited December 22, 2004 by Johnnyboxer

[bikespace]

No it's not competitive, it's rubbish, horrible, sell it to me cheap

If I have a go at twinshock it's exactly the bike I'd like to do it on. Unfortunately I'm about 4 stone heavier than I was when I actually rode one about 21 years ago so I'd probably need at least the 250.

I never had the proper tank either, my old man wasn't in to cosmetics

In my view, leave it with the original forks on, but I'm no expert on the current twinshock scene.

I love the look of it though. It reminds me of when I wasn't sh*t

P.S. You're just showing off having the TLR as well.

Edit: I seem to remember putting on a different front mudguard bracket which made the front end more stable (shorter front to back, but more substantial)...some of the twinshock guru's may have some pointers.

Edited December 22, 2004 by bikespace

[the artist formerly known as ish]

Can anyone remember who last rode a Majesty in a world round, year and location .

Clue, monoshocks were also in the event.

[woody]

Don't know the TLR200 well enough to comment on it, although I'd give the Majesty the edge if both are in standard trim.

As regards the Majesty I would also agree that it should be competitve enough in standard form as long as everything is working as it should - brakes, dampers etc. and you're not trying to compete against modern bikes.

The 175 forks are a smaller diameter than the 250 but are up to the job. They can be a little soft on the spring rate and damping but it is easy enough to experiment with different oil grades and spacers to pre-load the springs. To change to 250 forks you will have to bore out your yolks to take the larger diameter 250 legs, or fit 250 yolks also. They should fit straight in as the 175/250 use the same head bearings I believe. Although yours is a Godden frame I think they still retained the Yamaha head bearings which are ball race (and a ball-ache to fit....) However, the standard 250 forks are also under damped and have softish springs so there is not really any point changing. On works or supported rider Majesties, they were revalved to firm up the damping.

Mono forks are bigger diameter again. To fit a mono front end will require the headstock altering to take the different bearings for the mono yolks, or fitting the 175 stem into the mono yolks. You also have to bear in mind that the mono forks are leading axle, so they will increase the wheelbase and also alter the steering, making it slower.

I would stick with the 175 forks and concentrate on getting them right. Try it in a trial first to see how they perform and take it from there. You'll never get the right impression from them practising.

The engine should be powerful enough. It may well be a 200, being a Majesty. Just don't expect to pull high gears from low revs. It is an engine that has to be buzzed in low gears rather than plonked in higher gears, therefore ride it accordingly. And they will rev...... For an indication of how competitve it is you only have to look at the results of a Mr Postlethwaite who rides one up in Cumbria. He has humbled many a modern bike in the Lakes 2 day. It is a Birkett prepped bike I guess but still only a 200.

Finally - very nice bike. Looks superb. I'm sure I've seen it at a trial with a previous owner. Did you buy it from around the Stoke/Cheadle area. If so I'd guess it is the the bike I saw. If so the rims are tubeless I think, as are the tyres. They look tubeless rims from the photo.

Hope the 320 Majesty I'm building turns out that nice

[johnnyboxer]

Thanks guys for your advice..........

The bike is definitely a 175, not a 200 and the the build date/model has been confirmed by John Shirt, plus I've had the head off to check the bore size.

The comment about the forks were really to do with them feeling soggy compared to another standard TY175 I also own.The Godden frame headstock uses taper roller bearings like the TY250 mono's and not ballrace, so conversion should be no problem, however I prefer to stick to the originals if possible.

I have another better forkbrace/mudguard holder, since these pics.

The brakes work very well and have new shoes and the linings are in A1 condition.

I will strip the forks down and renew the springs with NOS ones I have already.Then experiment with different grade oil.

Rims aren't tubeless, Woody although the pics are deceptive and I did buy it about 2-3 years ago from the Derbyshire Peak District area...........so you are probably correct.

The bike looks like it hasn't done much work and everything looks pretty original (with the exception of rims/bars/levers). The Alloy Majesty tank is in A1 condition,with the original plastic retainer,plus it has right Majesty oil pump cover,Seat and Brake torque arms and came with original Gas Girlings,plus the Heatshield has the original Majesty sticker on it .......

So I think I'll take her out in 2005 and give a whirl to see if I get on.

The bike's now registered on an age related 1982 plate, so I can do a few road trials as well, if the need arises.

If I need more power then I can see Craig Mawlem for a 200 kit and also upgrade the ignition to electronic.

Finally what are they worth now in 2004...........can't see them depreciating now much after 20 years, are they worth 4 figure sums???

Another pic to whet your appetites

Edited December 23, 2004 by Johnnyboxer

[johnnyboxer]

Personally I would prefer a 175 Yam over a 200, as the smaller engine seems to rev much better than ones converted to 200.  A bike as nice as yours would probably make

[woody]

the Heatshield has the original Majesty sticker on it .......

Any chance of a close-up picture of that sticker as needless to say mine has long gone and no-one has any now. I can get one made from a copy

[t-shock 250]

Great little bikes these, but the only reason i wouldn't ride one is the fact that they don't have much power, basically you're up against it as soon as you come up against a decent hill climb or muddy gully or bog, i personally don't think it's a match for a TLR 200 but you can make it go well with a bit of engine work, a piston out of a jet ski and maximum revs all the way!

[booma]

the majesty or the tlr would be just fine as I have both (see honda posting tlr 200 tasty refurb) 1 thing I would recommend is to change the chain and sprockets to 9 front and 51 back fitted with a 428 chain, this makes a big difference, I can use 1-2-3 gears no problem and I weigh 13 stone

will you be riding the red\ novice route?

next year I plan to ride the inta\blue route on either bike and to do many classic rounds next year

see you all thier Booma (Andy Wilson)

here is a pic of my Yam I luv it

[johnnyboxer]

Currently my bke is fitted with 4.5 inch Domino Bars with brace and I think I'm going to find them too low (I'm 6'1" and 15.5 stone).

20 years ago I seem to remember we all had 6" Renthals...........with no cross-brace and they were strong enough then........are they still available without a brace??...........I've only seen 6" Renthals with a brace

[johnnyboxer]

the Heatshield has the original Majesty sticker on it .......

Any chance of a close-up picture of that sticker as needless to say mine has long gone and no-one has any now. I can get one made from a copy

Email or PM me Woody, with your email and I'll send you a copy, which is already scanned into the computer

[woody]

Currently my bke is fitted with 4.5 inch Domino Bars with brace and I think I'm going to find them too low (I'm 6'1" and 15.5 stone).

20 years ago I seem to remember we all had 6" Renthals...........with no cross-brace and they were strong enough then........are they still available without a brace??...........I've only seen 6" Renthals with a brace

Not sure if you will get the old style braceless renthals now. Must admit though, the shape of the modern braced type have a better feel to them than the old style. Don't know why but definitely feel more positive on the steering. Not sure about the old ones being strong enough as we used to break bars all the time in the 70s. Can't remember the last time I broke a modern braced pair (so guess what will happen Boxing day when I borrow my mate's Sherco.....)

Have you thought about lowering the footrests. Shouldn't be too bad a job on your bike as the brackets bolt on don't they, so you don't have to chop the frame? If so, make or buy some new brackets and lower the footrest hangers, maybe move them back a bit too but caution here as it is a short wheelbase bike and you don't want to make it too light on the front by going too rearwards. All of the Yams suffer from footrests that are too high for tall riders. I've had to do the same on my 320 Majesty. The footrests were almost 17" off the ground.....!! - almost like standing on the saddle. Lowering them has the same affect as higher bars but with the added benefit that you are standing lower in the bike, rather than over it, which helps balance. Like a modern bike riding position. Worth looking at.

[woody]

Andy (Booma)

Just out of interest what shocks are those fitted on your Yam?

[feetupfun]

The 175 forks are a smaller diameter than the 250 but are up to the job. They can be a little soft on the spring rate and damping but it is easy enough to experiment with different oil grades and spacers to pre-load the springs. To change to 250 forks you will have to bore out your yolks to take the larger diameter 250 legs, or fit 250 yolks also. They should fit straight in as the 175/250 use the same head bearings I believe. Although yours is a Godden frame I think they still retained the Yamaha head bearings which are ball race (and a ball-ache to fit....) However, the standard 250 forks are also under damped and have softish springs so there is not really any point changing. On works or supported rider Majesties, they were revalved to firm up the damping.

There are benefits from using the forks from a TY250 twinshock in your Godden Majesty.

I tried every possible combination of fork oil weight and quantity, preload variation and front end height, even tried (single rate) springs from a 1974 TM 125 motocrosser in my TY175 forks but was never happy with the action on mid to large obstacles. You could set them up for large obstacles but then they were not very good for small obstacles. Possibly if I was lighter than my 89kg the standard forks may have been OK.

I recently fitted TY250B forks with purpose made springs from B&J Racing in the USA to my TY175 and found that I could get the front end working well on large dry boulders and during heavy landings yet was still nice on small stuff.

Yes both steering stems and steering head tubes are the same but the TY250 tubes being a larger (34mm) diameter come closer to the fuel tank on the TY175 than the standard forks on full lock. Both sets of triple clamps share the same offset geometry. TY250 clamps are simply TY175 clamps with bigger holes. Aftermarket tapered needle roller bearings for top and bottom are the modern remedy to the standard Yamaha steering head bearings. I use the same brand of tapered needle roller bearings in both a TY175 and TY250B and have found that this allows rapidly front end swaps between bikes if needed (ie no need to move bearings from seats).

I don't know about where you live, but forks and triple clamps from TY250 twinshock bikes are readily available from bike wreckers here in OZ.

I can post photos if anyone is interested.

[eric23]

I'm running a stock TY175 in club level events and find the power to be adequate. I recently installed 5.5" braced Renthal bars and they are a major improvement (to be fair they replaced some un marked, bent cast offs). I also have the Miller pegs, yet still lowering them about 1/2" is on my "to do" list. I agree with Woody that the footrest position is too high. On a slightly different subject...how are the fiberglass Miller/Magesty tanks holding up? I read an article on a vintage bike site where the new alchohol/MTBE fuel blends mandated by many states (USA) for pollution control are eating at fiberglass resins and causing a real mess.