Is Four Stroke Fading Away?..

[the observer]

Pollution, Modern 2T's using modern oils have very little difference to 4T's. Even California doesn't ban 2T engines.

Two Strokes are restricted in California. Off-road they are limited to certain areas and can only be used during a few months of the year. They were banned from any on-road use years ago.

[steve fracy]

Both the 2T and 4T bikes work well! Pick what you like the best. The biggest problem that everyone keeps forgetting is that the 4Ts cost way more than the 2Ts. Biggest reason that they have dropped off in sales.

[benbeta23]

With regard to the 2T points

2T engines CAN live as long as 4T's if looked after.

2T are excellent Machines & I love them, But that statement is the most load of rubbish I have ever heard before, No matter how much you disagree a 2T engine will never live longer than a 4T, Fair enough if you look after a 2T it will live for more time But The 4T engine is so much more reliable. Hence one of the reasons why they cost much more to make.

[for artie]

There is a difference between PRICE and COST.

[benbeta23]

There is a difference between PRICE and COST.

Did it take you that long to figure that out?

[copemech]

2T are excellent Machines & I love them, But that statement is the most load of rubbish I have ever heard before, No matter how much you disagree a 2T engine will never live longer than a 4T, Fair enough if you look after a 2T it will live for more time But The 4T engine is so much more reliable. Hence one of the reasons why they cost much more to make.

In the old days, this statement might be correct, yet on the new light motors, I am not sure about all that! Just ask the MX and enduro croud!

[benbeta23]

In the old days, this statement might be correct, yet on the new light motors, I am not sure about all that! Just ask the MX and enduro croud!

There both as good as each other in there on ways.

[tony27]

Going on the number of parents looking to offload their 250f mx bikes to get 2Ts due to expensive blow ups at less than 16hrs old I can't agree with the 4Ts outlasting 2Ts anymore

[benbeta23]

That's MX Bikes though, Only trouble with 2 stroke MX bikes is that there so yappy and everyone hates them, If the 4RT's weren't so expensive, The 4 stroke would probably be just as popular as the 2T, Shame Not everyone knows what the Beta 4T is like as well, Because that must be the must under estimated Trials bike on the planet, There spot on to ride. The 4RT & the Beta 4T have such reliable engines, Not saying the 2 strokes haven't, But the 4T's are bombproof.

[telecat]

That's MX Bikes though, Only trouble with 2 stroke MX bikes is that there so yappy and everyone hates them, If the 4RT's weren't so expensive, The 4 stroke would probably be just as popular as the 2T, Shame Not everyone knows what the Beta 4T is like as well, Because that must be the must under estimated Trials bike on the planet, There spot on to ride. The 4RT & the Beta 4T have such reliable engines, Not saying the 2 strokes haven't, But the 4T's are bombproof.

The 4RT isn't a panacea. It has it's own problems for riders. At least 2 local riders visibly improved after ditching them and at least one of those did try the 4T Beta and rejected it. He now rides GasGas and achieves better results on them. Another went to the EVO 2T and again achieves better results. As for reliability I can't see much between 2T and 4T. However for example, over revving a 2T does not cause any damage whereas 4T's could well damage the valve gear. Engine problems are also more expensive to fix as the engines are more difficult to extract from the frame.

Basically The 2T's are for the majority of Trials the better choice for MOST riders and are cheaper to run. 4T's are great bikes but limited in a Trials context. The extra cost of 4T's especially the Montesa has meant MOST riders will not fork out the extra dosh.

[benbeta23]

The 4RT isn't a panacea. It has it's own problems for riders. At least 2 local riders visibly improved after ditching them and at least one of those did try the 4T Beta and rejected it. He now rides GasGas and achieves better results on them. Another went to the EVO 2T and again achieves better results. As for reliability I can't see much between 2T and 4T. However for example, over revving a 2T does not cause any damage whereas 4T's could well damage the valve gear. Engine problems are also more expensive to fix as the engines are more difficult to extract from the frame.

Basically The 2T's are for the majority of Trials the better choice for MOST riders and are cheaper to run. 4T's are great bikes but limited in a Trials context. The extra cost of 4T's especially the Montesa has meant MOST riders will not fork out the extra dosh.

I know the Montesa's cost a lot of money, & The Monts & other 4T's can also go wrong & sometimes can be a pain in the backside to fix because they have a lot more parts to them rather than a 2T, But any bike can, I Know with my GG 300 I had last year, I'm not joking, But I had to fix it every single week, It was the worst bike I have ever owned, But When 2 strokes go wrong, they seriously can be a pain to get round, as I experienced with My GG 300, I'm not so sure that I'd 100% agree with that you can't over rev a 4T, The 2T's are better for reving the backside off, But I don't think that You will damage the Valve Gear, Only probably if you really really over rev it, I know a few lads who are always reving the Monts to near the Max & they seem to cope pretty well. I still think that the 4T engines will last a hell of a lot longer than a 2T, Only problem is, is that there are a lot more bits to them than a 2T.

[nzralphy]

I've had both. You guys my be missing a point. Servicing! I have my Beta4T apart to do the valves right now and it is a demanding/technical job that many people don't know how to do. I find it easy and enjoyable but do have friends that wouldn't want the hassle. Oh and i bet i spent less on oil with my 2T than i do on the 4T.

I still think the 4T is a better bike.... for me.

[copemech]

That is a good example from Ralphy!

The Evo 4T is probably the prime example of the modern 4T. I have ridden them and they are sweet in both 250 and 300 versions.

Seems there was one recent report in the threads for a worn valve guide issue, although he was a bit shy on specifics. I still do find any 4T more maintenance intensive, and although the Monts seem to have their own quirks add a bit on the heavy side, they can be fantastic bikes, yet one does not really want to know the cost of fixing these things when they go tits up, or the cost of mudguard for that matter.

All said, I have been tempted many times over the years, yet find my private life(NOT constantly working on stuff) much simpler with a 2T!

For anyone without the neccessary tools, skills and equipment, things can get ugly real quick!

[jimmyl]

Not sure on the Beta but owned a 4rt for over 3 years and required maintenance was minimal -- even after SSDT and Scott. I think you may also be surprised at the price of Mont spares - ie rear disc

[ishy]

I wonder if an actual four stroke class would of boosted sales of modern four bangers.

Obviously Mr Bou is beating two bangers on a four stroke, it might of been a better approach by the FIM to have gone that route than state all bikes must be four stroke by year 94/5/6/7/8/ or summat along those lines.

I have a couple in my shed and love riding them, but I don't think they perform better in the section than the two banger and people don't want to pay extra for them if thier results won't improve, inbetween the sections and trail riding it's a different story and I would opt for the four banger every time.

I think the four stroke run a lot better on this **** they call fuel nower days too.