Multi Class Trials - How Many Routes / How To Flag?

[big john]

The biggest problem to overcome is the "We've always done it our way, so why should we change" attitude. Why fix something that isn't broke? Or is it!

Yes, that is the problem, in Scotland we did have a problem, too many variations with clubs doing their own thing, there was no control... it was broke and it needed a quick fix, it wasn't too popular when it was announced, but the riders wanted a simple system and one that everyone could grasp quickly. It was formulated from rider opinion gathering.

For sure, there were minor teething problems with riders occassionally going off on the wrong route, then it settled down and surprisingly quite quickly and one year down the line and those problems are no longer an issue.

I think there were more objections from the clubs than the riders to be honest about it. Some officials were a bit stuck in the past like: "the reds and blues on either side of the section have worked fine for as long as I can remember, why do we need to change?"

The objections turned out to be false, its in place now and the riders would probably not relish a return to the old system... if it was offered.

I think the ACU would like to introduce a unified marking system, but there are so many centres to gain committment from. In Scotland it was a dictatorial situation when it was introduced, harsh medicine, but it worked!

Big John

[wri5hty]

I think something has been slightly missed of Steve's initial post we are running 4 groups on 3 routes by having a 50/50 course for intermediates.

experts red/blue

inters 50/50

clubman a green deviation

clubman b yellow deviation

inters ride expert course unless stated different on the start cards, so where we go big for the experts they drop down onto the clubman a ( green route ).

previously the inters did the exact same sections as the experts and clubman A did a 50/50 route swapping between expert sections and clubman b sections ( 2 route trial ). this for me was making some section too hard or too easy for some riders, and any expert finding trials getting a bit hard couldn't drop down into inters, they are still doing the same section so whats the point, they would go down into clubman A win every trial and then get moaned at as being a pot hunter ( no win situation ).

From what i can see from this post is most of us use the same colored flags near enough RED, BLUE, YELLOW, & GREEN or WHITE. we are not far off.

The other point is none of us seem too have the same classes expert, inter, clubman, novice, beginner, a route, b route, c route, and so on. its a bit of a muddle really.

How nice would it be too go anywhere in the country and be faced with the same classes, route marking, entry form. so all you have too ask is how sadistic the Clark of the course is.

I don't expect the ACU to make these rules up as they would be in for a kicking from some quarters. maybe if some brave sole on here came up with a basic principle and the rest of us try agree too it, bring it up at centre meetings and see what happens. if 50% of clubs or centres went down the same road it cant be all bad.

I'm not brave enough ( i bruise easily ). many other users of the site have gained a lot of respect from the trials community, people may listen too them. BIG JOHN do you fancy eating your spinach and sorting us English out.

PS I'm just asking if this can be done fellas don't shout at me.

[1st gear steve]

Hear Hear !!

It is great to hear so many very similar views from guys all around the country - we all appear though to be the ones sticking the flags in!

If we are prepared to put even extra work in of our own time to benefit the entry, we must have something.

Would be nice to get more feedback from the riders that use this site...........................

Is it what they want?

[big john]

BIG JOHN do you fancy eating your spinach and sorting us English out.

I've already had a word (or two) with ACU committee guys in private over the last 12 months on this matter, they are for the idea of standardisation, but they need the support of the centres to make it happen...over to you guys!

Don't forget the people on the ACU Trials and Enduro committee are all enthusiasts and ex-current riders, they do listen to what is going on!

Big John

[jamersby]

Although I am repeating what has already been posted in my opinion Big John ticks all the right boxes ( maybe we should elect him as president ) if all clubs run a unified coloured marker system yellow/easy to red/expert or whatever allowing riders to choose the colour section that suits their capability, a coloured sticker on your number to show what section your riding that seems straight forward and simple to me.

To introduce the green route for all clubs the only draw back that I can see is for example, Earls Shilton started the green route this year attracting a good entry of riders, but they have the ideal trials ground to do this, other clubs are not so fortunate to be able to offer a third deviation to the sections, I don't know the answer to this one.

For me as a rider to enter a trial at any club knowing I will ride say the white route is simple, probably nothing will change and things will stay as they are, but a unified maker would be a start.

[pete_scorpa3]

Fully behind you on that one.

We have been running the coloured arrow system for three years now and the riders unanimously like it. If you go the wrong side of an arrow with your colour on it, then it's only you to blame. Couldn't be simpler. Look at your colour and ignore all of the others.

I often hear the "Blue left, Red right.... it's always been like that!" argument, but then they are often the same riders who ride the easy route on pairs of whites or what ever.

Blue/Red for the main route and pairs of whites for the other route is bonkers. If you need two colours on the main route, then you also need two colours onthe other routes.

Try setting out a trial with four routes using two colours on each!!!!!! Acid trip!

The whole thing is so easy. Descide on the colour for each of four routes. Make it a national standard. Start using it from 1st Jan. Job done.

[perce]

The whole thing is so easy. Descide on the colour for each of four routes. Make it a national standard. Start using it from 1st Jan. Job done.

So what would happen to a club say that had 10000 flags or so currently in stock, all bought & paid for?

[big john]

So what would happen to a club say that had 10000 flags or so currently in stock, all bought & paid for?

If you are talking about the Scott, that is an exceptional case, like the Scottish Six Days, they have one route and the old system of Red on the right and Blue on the left still applies!

It's the multi-route system that is the problem.

Big John

(Please don't elect me for anything!)

[perce]

If you are talking about the Scott, that is an exceptional case, like the Scottish Six Days, they have one route and the old system of Red on the right and Blue on the left still applies!

It's the multi-route system that is the problem.

Big John

(Please don't elect me for anything!)

There's a hand me down system but I'd say there'd be enough flags in circulation to have the Scott, All days of the 3 Day & probably 2 or 3 club Trials all marked out at the same time.

[taff_d]

Does it really matter what colour the flags are ? turn up pick your class pay your money then ride the flags you are told, it's not rocket science.

I rode M'bro 2 day at Fryup and there flag system worked well, I rode Eboracum and Thirsk last weekend and their system works ok, I know Guisborough use there own flag system and this weekend its a Scarborough trial and they are using a purple route for the first time for beginners.

I'm a beginner to the sport and I've managed to suss every club out so far, I say leave it as it is as it could cause mayhem to change to a universal system.

[pete_scorpa3]

As the Six Days was held in Scotland with just one route, what system was used for that? Is it under the jurasdiction of the SACU?

[pete_scorpa3]

I'm a beginner to the sport and I've managed to suss every club out so far, I say leave it as it is as it could cause mayhem to change to a universal system.

Isn't that exactly what we have now? Mayhem instead of a universal system.

[wri5hty]

Taff your just talking about the east Yorks center where we are all round about the same ( just trying different things ). once you move outside of it and ride at another centre everything is different picking your class and riding it is not as easy as you would think. standardization across the whole country makes total sense.

I feel that the dual route trial at centre level is coming too the end of its life span in the way single route did many years ago. nationals are fine on dual route in the same way as the ssdt and scott are fine on single route, everyone expects a harder days sport at these events so you make the choice too ride.

At normal club trials a route for everyone is not much too ask. our 2 day turned out a great weekend and for me thats because we are using multi route. the argument on this will run for a while in this centre thats why a bit of feedback good or bad from local riders would be appreciated.

[1st gear steve]

Nice to see that more of the clubs in the E.Yorks centre are joining the flag revolution started by Middlesbrough DMC.

With Hull AC already on board, Thirsk went this way at the recent event & Scarbrough (who offered a 3rd course previous, though at the hard end) are going to give it a go.

Of all the riders i have spoke to this system is fast gathering support & now with clubs 'Moving over to the Green side' I believe our trials will genuinely offer more to more riders.

With there been 3 clear courses (for the 4 classes), if all clubs bought into this we could go back to the 'Old' class names - EXP - INTER - NOV - C/MAN.

Anyone got any views on this?

[johnnyboxer]

With there been 3 clear courses (for the 4 classes), if all clubs bought into this we could go back to the 'Old' class names - EXP - INTER - NOV - C/MAN.

Anyone got any views on this?

I'd like to go back to the old names, having been away from Trials for 20 years and would prefer 3 individual courses, returning to trials in the last 2 years took me a while to get back into it.

Are Scarboro' employing this system now?