totalshell Posted January 1, 2011 Report Share Posted January 1, 2011 (edited) Earlier in the thread, I picked up a reference to the goodwood festival of speed and an inference that all was milk and honey in the word of classic cars… if you want a can of worms there it is. i used to trial and race vintage (pre war) cars it reached the stage where the clubs issued eligibility certificates for cars however I have fitted alternators to cars that were made 20 years before the first alternator, fitted hydraulic brakes to cars that previously only had cable brakes on one axle, fitted one off cranks to cars, fitted specially cast in 1991 heads to cars that were built in 1927 so please don’t hold up shiny cars of an example of what good should look like. Like many, I would aspire to do the pre 65 Scottish although having seen riders that i can compete on equal terms with struggle last year i accept that participating is beyond me. I will though DEFINITELY be there again this year to spectate (if i can afford the diesel, which went up to 133.9 at my local garage this am) I travel to see the countries best riders compete in the best trial, to see the best examples of developed bikes and the best examples of genuine preserved bikes from that era. Who wins is of no consequence as long as bikes are ridden as i would like to think i ride, enthusiastically and sportsmanlike. May the best man win but the last man enjoy himself… Edited January 1, 2011 by totalshell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big john Posted January 1, 2011 Report Share Posted January 1, 2011 Big John on the bench for the time being ...There was me thinking you were a shoe in.... The annual sacrifice to the ballot gods not working this year... Bon Soir Who said I was on the bench, from where did you get this information? You are totally mistaken there sir! Big John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big john Posted January 1, 2011 Report Share Posted January 1, 2011 May the best man win but the last man enjoy himself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metisse Posted January 2, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 I took it from a previous post where you stated " You are not alone " referring to being a reserve. I assumed incorrectly that you too were a reserve, perhaps its good news after all... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie prescott Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 Hi Guy's. Hi Big"J" I like Mettise, Thought you were on the reserve list!! That Is the problem with words, and phrases. They all have a different meaning to those who are interpreting them. And this is the crux of the matter concerning machine specification? You can read into it whatever you like! and in most cases a scrutineer of a trials bike is not going to care very much?? as long has nothing is falling off, and the brakes actually seem to work??? So basically you can hide what you like on a machine if you can get away with it?? Just spotted a advert for a "Trials Cub" with hydraulic clutch, Pre65 it says!! Well I could have made a clutch on Cub work with hydraulic before 1965? But it would have been a job hiding the Austin Mini master cylinder?? Regards Charlie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big john Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 I took it from a previous post where you stated " You are not alone " referring to being a reserve. I assumed incorrectly that you too were a reserve, perhaps its good news after all... Well there you go Metisse, you made the wrong assumption then. "B40RT" aka Ross, is not of course alone, what I knew was there are others that are on the reserve list, had a few phone calls about it. Ah well, never mind, you can please some of the people.......! I don't believe in sacrifices either, I have always taken the view, if I get in, fair enough, if I don't.. same applies. Regards, Big John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old trials fanatic Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 (edited) Paul, first comment was a generalisation. From above: the point is it's bugger all to do with us, it's the decision of the organising club not the riders to decide the rules and regs, you like them put an entry in you don't, well I quite sure folk can spectate, help out or find something else. You've made a comment in the thread about the Sportsman Class about the changes YOU have made to YOUR events to make them more rideable, It was YOUR decision probably based on feedback and you manybe have the option to do that. I don't think the Edinburgh Club have that choice, they react to the pressures of the demands of this one event. OK just wanted to clarify the point i was trying to make. When i said we should decide if it's a competition or a pagent the "we" to which i refered was the readers and contributors to Trials Central but i meant in the context of comments about "fiddle" "trick" "modified" bikes because i feel if the Trial is intended as a competition then you must expect competitors to build the most competitive machinery they can possibly build using whatever resources they can muster. However if the event should be viewed as a pagent, many contributors bemoan the absence of "std" as in resembling the factory catalogue pictures of the period have you ever compared a HT5 brochure piccy to what will be competing?, of period bikes then i suppose the detractors are correct in lambasting the current crop of "Pre65" bikes. AT NO POINT DID I INTEND TO INFER THAT THE EVENT WAS OR SHOULD BE RUN OTHER THAN HOW THE ORGANISING CLUB DEEM IT TO. Seriously i did not mean the contributors to this site should or could have any influence on the organising club. I just feel most of the moans about machine eligability miss the point that if you are competing by definition you will probably / definately want the most competitive machinery available. That was the same in 1964 as now just the engineering is better now. Still dont think anything done was not possible back then just not probable or maybe considering the section they rode back then compared to the sections they ride now didnt require it. Was watching a DVD yesterday six from the scottish i think it was called and a section "Devils Staircase" was used. Dont remember it being used now but from the look of it some modern road bike could do it? might be mistaken but it looked nothing like what competitors are required to ride nowadays. Thus bikes have developed. Anyway i appologise if i inferred that the organisation of the event should be by us and not the organising club. I just find the concept of entering a competition and deliberately penalising yourself by riding uncompetitive machinery ridiculous and illogical. The reference i made to the Goodwood Festival of Speed was because it was the only pagent of machinery which generally appeared to be as used in the period that it was pertaining to represent that i could think of. Only true Pre65 bike i have ridden, an AJS, even though it had modern tyres and shocks was really orrible and i can not imagine why anybody in their right mind would want to try to lug that around the Scottish Pre65 course without extensive modification. Edited January 2, 2011 by Old trials fanatic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big john Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 (edited) "Was watching a DVD yesterday six from the scottish i think it was called and a section "Devils Staircase" was used. Dont remember it being used now but from the look of it some modern road bike could do it? might be mistaken but it looked nothing like what competitors are required to ride nowadays. Thus bikes have developed." point 1 - I certainly would not want to ride the old Staircase on a road bike, I have walked up it many times, I know exactly where it is, its trickier than it looks on film! "Only true Pre65 bike i have ridden, an AJS, even though it had modern tyres and shocks was really orrible and i can not imagine why anybody in their right mind would want to try to lug that around the Scottish Pre65 course without extensive modification." Point 2 - I have many times, except it was called a "Matchless - G3C 1959, same as an AJS, only the timing casing and tank decoration differs! And it wasn't seriously modified other than Renthal bars, 18inch rear rim; alloy rims fore and aft and modern footrests! - A proper Pre-65 bike wholely and exclusively... well within the spirit of the Pre65 Scottish! Edited January 3, 2011 by Slapshot 3 Fixed quotes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old trials fanatic Posted January 3, 2011 Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 (edited) point 1 - I certainly would not want to ride the old Staircase on a road bike, I have walked up it many times, I know exactly where it is, its trickier than it looks on film! Point 2 - I have many times, except it was called a "Matchless - G3C 1959, same as an AJS, only the timing casing and tank decoration differs! And it wasn't seriously modified other than Renthal bars, 18inch rear rim; alloy rims fore and aft and modern footrests! - A proper Pre-65 bike wholely and exclusively... well within the spirit of the Pre65 Scottish! I doff my flat cap to you BJ A friend of mine also rides his Matchless up and over things i would never try on that bike but i think you and Barry are the exception rather than the rule. Good luck to both of you though. Still dont get the attraction of making life harder for yourself than necessary but have much respect for those that want to. Was only trying to explain in my obviously clumsy way why people modify bikes to the extent they do. Dont get why so many people moan about it either. Must be me i must be the odd one out Edited January 3, 2011 by Old trials fanatic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minislim Posted January 6, 2011 Report Share Posted January 6, 2011 well another year and another dissapointment. this time though a feeble excuse of my entry being received 3 days after the closing date. ha! with all the backlog of post especially going north of the border this has to be the lamest excuse ever. surely a extra week or so extension would have been commonplace with other events. year upon year i talk to fellow riders who always struggle to get a ride and as more and more these riders get fed up of this they are not even bothering to try and enter anymore. these are the week in week out pre65 riders who keep classic trials alive and well up and down the country. having helped and supported the pre65 scottish way back since 1992 i feel seriously let down and i am not the only one. if this carries on the way its going i can only really see another decade before it falls foul of more and more dissapointed riders who give up with the even and loose interest in it altogther. and it would be a shame to loose such an historic even. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big john Posted January 6, 2011 Report Share Posted January 6, 2011 well another year and another dissapointment. this time though a feeble excuse of my entry being received 3 days after the closing date. ha! with all the backlog of post especially going north of the border this has to be the lamest excuse ever. surely a extra week or so extension would have been commonplace with other events. It's a well known fact that if an entry is received after the closing date, that in itself is sufficient for the organising club to reject the entry. The entries opened in October that is surely time enough to get an entry to the event secretary? Big John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totalshell Posted January 6, 2011 Report Share Posted January 6, 2011 to be fair John we are still recieving Christmas cards even down here in the bustling metropolis, credit card statements recieved after the payment date this week ( bank have agreed to waive interest thankfully) i dont know minislim to talk to but he and his father ride pre65 EVERY week and thus his frustration carries some weight and his view that week in week out riders dont enter because of a belief that your first three entries are a waste of postage, was certainly a view that i heard repeated at the largest pre65 trial last weekend. i hold firm in my belief that the edingburgh club can let ride who they want but how positive for the trial and the sport would it be if the 'draw' were to be made as open as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minislim Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 it will also be very interesting to see which "usual suspects" have got a ride yet again. looking back a the last 19 years there are at least 20 riders with 100% entry success rate! as say. year upon year more and more are giving up on the event. its ok now but if it carries on it could end up ruining the event in future years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old trials fanatic Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 it will also be very interesting to see which "usual suspects" have got a ride yet again. looking back a the last 19 years there are at least 20 riders with 100% entry success rate! as say. year upon year more and more are giving up on the event. its ok now but if it carries on it could end up ruining the event in future years. I will probably get lambasted again for daring to ever pass anything but glowing praise for the organisers, doffs cap bows profusely whilst tugging forelock, but every year the same comments about the "ballot" LOL and machines crop up. I think the only conclusion people should come to is that the organisers dont give a toss what we the great unwashed think or do as long as they stay oversubscribed they couldnt give a monkeys. As has been made patently clear to me on this forum on many occaisions "ITS THEIR EVENT NOT OURS AND THEY WILL ORGANISE IT AS THEY SEE FIT". Must admit after speaking to a lot of local riders who also compete on a weekly or at worst monthly basis actually riding British bikes in Classic Trials they are getting to the point where they dont bother about the Scottish Pre65 either. Oh we have our rants and moans on here but nothing will change so why do we bother??? no idea really. Just from a personal viewpoint that everything was conducted more openly. One question i havent seen voiced for a while is why dont you have to qualify for the event??? Bit like the old British Experts. Then again as previously stated it's their ball and they aint bothered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b40rt Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 Just from a personal viewpoint that everything was conducted more openly. One question i havent seen voiced for a while is why dont you have to qualify for the event??? Bit like the old British Experts. Sorry, but very few riders would qualify as being "regular" competetors in Scottish Pre-65 events. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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