Oset Batteries Lithium (LiPo) Conversion Directions

[gwhy]

This is a very interesting topic, and are almost more confused than when I've started reading. I dont want to sound lazy, but I am.

It seems that ninefives, frogger, gwhy know their stuff??

First of all, the charging seems very cumbersome, ballacing etc, at this moment after riding, plug it in, leave it till the next time, and ride. Do you have to unplug the batteries everytime, and recharge them, balance etc? Can I keep them in the bike for charging?

Bottomline, I would like replace both sets of batteries on the OSET 12.5, and 36.

I think the 12.5 is 24v?

What must I buy where, and what should I do??

Low voltage buzzer? Does the lights indicators on the throttle work, so that stop riding on say 2 lights?

Chargers?

Batteries? (for both bikes)

2 x 5s1p 8000 mAh batteries, with 2 chargers? for the 36v

For the 12.5, 2 Zippy Flightmax 6S1P 15C 5,000 mAH

Can you take these batteries on a plane? My Dad is in the UK at this moment.

What chargers do I need to charge everything similtaniously?

First off : you do not have to balance the battery everytime you re-charge ( but worth checking the balance of the cells before every re-charge ) the chargers have this facilitly , or buy a standalone battery medic ( which is a better bet as the checking can be done very quickly )..only balance them when needed. I would advise to re-charge the battery after everyride even if it was 1 or 2 miles ( this will help the battery stay healthier for longer. I would also advise to remove the battery from the charger once they are charged ( as electronics can just go wrong without warning ). I would also advise to remove the battery from the bike for re-charging as batterys can catch fire and you would not want your bike to get burned, also DO NOT charge overnight in the house just in case they catch fire, best charge them in a shed or garage or better still in a fire safe area. ALL battery can catch fire but lipos if not looked after do so quite spectacularly.

The lights on the throttle will not be accurate enough if you convert to lipo, so you would need either a off the shelf lipo alarm or a volt meter/watt meter connected to the bike when you are riding so it can be seen this will then be your fuel gauge.

you will need 2X6c1p 5000ma for a 24v 10AH battery

I can remember what most peeps are using for the 36v ( maybe some one will chip in )

You can charge everything ( dependant of your configuration for the 36v battery ) with 1 charger, but this will be a pain and will also take ages to charge, so the very minimum you will need 2 chargers and that will make it more user friendly

but the more chargers you get the better/faster you can get everything charged back up. I not 100% sure, but I dont think you can take them on a plane. The batterys are bought from Hobbyking in china along with everything else that you will need.

[reinhardt]

First off : you do not have to balance the battery everytime you re-charge ( but worth checking the balance of the cells before every re-charge ) the chargers have this facilitly , or buy a standalone battery medic ( which is a better bet as the checking can be done very quickly )..only balance them when needed. I would advise to re-charge the battery after everyride even if it was 1 or 2 miles ( this will help the battery stay healthier for longer. I would also advise to remove the battery from the charger once they are charged ( as electronics can just go wrong without warning ). I would also advise to remove the battery from the bike for re-charging as batterys can catch fire and you would not want your bike to get burned, also DO NOT charge overnight in the house just in case they catch fire, best charge them in a shed or garage or better still in a fire safe area. ALL battery can catch fire but lipos if not looked after do so quite spectacularly.

The lights on the throttle will not be accurate enough if you convert to lipo, so you would need either a off the shelf lipo alarm or a volt meter/watt meter connected to the bike when you are riding so it can be seen this will then be your fuel gauge.

you will need 2X6c1p 5000ma for a 24v 10AH battery

I can remember what most peeps are using for the 36v ( maybe some one will chip in )

You can charge everything ( dependant of your configuration for the 36v battery ) with 1 charger, but this will be a pain and will also take ages to charge, so the very minimum you will need 2 chargers and that will make it more user friendly

but the more chargers you get the better/faster you can get everything charged back up. I not 100% sure, but I dont think you can take them on a plane. The batterys are bought from Hobbyking in china along with everything else that you will need.

Thank you very much, I'll get a buzzer like in the previous posts, so that he must stop, and head back.

I see that Frogger has put in 6 x 8000mAh 3SP1 packs, 3 in series (11.1v x 3) and then parallel (8000mAh x2), any difference from 2 x 5s1p 8000 mAh batteries, with 2 chargers? for the 36v??

[gwhy]

by paralleling the battery you combine the mAh so frogger has 16000mAh ( 16Ah ) you will only have 8Ah , the Ah rating is how much charge the battery can store ( so a 16Ah will last twice as long as a 8Ah ) but the 16Ah will take twice as long to charge ( if using the same charger ). 2x 5s1p in series will give you around 40V hot off the charger and should be fine to run the 36v motor ( it will be a little faster top speed )

like you have said , the most stright forward way for the 36v would be 2 x $18 50W chargers from HK , these can only charge at 2.8A for the 5s so you will be looking at around a 2.5 hour charge time for each 5s 8Ah battery from each charger.

I try and stick with 5000mAh batterys and parallel them up as these are more common and a bit cheaper to replace should one battery go wrong ( as different Ah rating can not be mixed safely )

Edited July 26, 2012 by gwhy

[frogger]

I would advise to re-charge the battery after everyride even if it was 1 or 2 miles ( this will help the battery stay healthier for longer. I would also advise to remove the battery from the charger once they are charged ( as electronics can just go wrong without warning ). I would also advise to remove the battery from the bike for re-charging as batterys can catch fire and you would not want your bike to get burned, also DO NOT charge overnight in the house just in case they catch fire, best charge them in a shed or garage or better still in a fire safe area. ALL battery can catch fire but lipos if not looked after do so quite spectacularly.

Great advice. Very important to follow. Do not leave your lipo's connected to anything when not in use. I only ever charge my lipo's where I can see them.

Edited August 1, 2012 by frogger

[juanroberts]

Do not leave your lipo's connected to anything when not in use.

+1

We forgot to turn off the motorcycle after a short ride and our Lipos are now fully drained, and from what I read useless.

[frogger]

+1

We forgot to turn off the motorcycle after a short ride and our Lipos are now fully drained, and from what I read useless.

http://thunderpowerr....-BATTERIES.pdf

Edited August 1, 2012 by frogger

[ninefives]

+1

We forgot to turn off the motorcycle after a short ride and our Lipos are now fully drained, and from what I read useless.

Wow - sorry to hear the news - a lesson for all of us in the Lipo world!!

I've not used the Lipo alarms since they screwed up a couple of individual cells in 2 batteries. The discipline we have is that the bike is switched off when you get off the bike at any time - we had someone twist the throttle when looking at the bike while we were looking at a section, it tried to attack a nearby tree!! At the end of the ride I disconnect the batteries before loading.

I can see it happening while playing around at home, rolled in the garage and left on - the lipo alarms would definitely have saved the batteries as they would have been chirrping endlessly.

[sparkalounger]

Okay guys, thinking of making the leap here...

what about this:

http://www.nycewheels.com/lithium-polymer-ae-3610.html

or this:

http://www.nycewheels.com/10ah-lithium-ebike-battery-seat-post-mount.html

with a charger like this:

http://www.nycewheels.com/ezeebike-lithium-battery-charger.html

or this:

http://www.nycewheels.com/lithium-polymer-36v-charger.html

From what I can tell the discharge limiter is all built in, a plug and play scenario.

Any thoughts would be much appreciated... I am not up to speed on this and my business doesn't allow me much time to research and educate myself to the extent that I am comfortable making a decision on my own.

[gwhy]

Okay guys, thinking of making the leap here...

what about this:

http://www.nycewheel...er-ae-3610.html

or this:

http://www.nycewheel...post-mount.html

with a charger like this:

http://www.nycewheel...ry-charger.html

or this:

http://www.nycewheel...6v-charger.html

From what I can tell the discharge limiter is all built in, a plug and play scenario.

Any thoughts would be much appreciated... I am not up to speed on this and my business doesn't allow me much time to research and educate myself to the extent that I am comfortable making a decision on my own.

I dont think this battery will be very good for this application as it can only deliver 20A max , built in BMS can seem a very good option but from my experience BMS can be more of a pain and end up causing more problems with your battery than its worth. BMS starts to become usefully on a much bigger battery i.e 100-200v but personally for anything smaller than 50v then forget it, its easier/safer just to manage the battery yourself.

[awdrocks]

Okay guys, thinking of making the leap here...

what about this:

http://www.nycewheel...er-ae-3610.html

or this:

http://www.nycewheel...post-mount.html

with a charger like this:

http://www.nycewheel...ry-charger.html

or this:

http://www.nycewheel...6v-charger.html

From what I can tell the discharge limiter is all built in, a plug and play scenario.

Any thoughts would be much appreciated... I am not up to speed on this and my business doesn't allow me much time to research and educate myself to the extent that I am comfortable making a decision on my own.

I heard that someone used this 36v 10ah you posted here with the built in BMS on their 16'' and seemed to get about 4-4.5hrs of run time oin ONE charge. Just wired up this battery and called it a day.

I'm personally going to take this leap and give it a shot. Even with just 3hrs of run time that would be outstanding.

[gwhy]

if its getting 4-4.5hrs of run time then the battery/16" can not be a great performer , expample: if you have a 500w motor and running at 36v then the controller needs to be limitied to around 20A ( this is acutally more like 700W ) so riding up hill only give you 0.5 hour with a 10ah battery but I normally look at a round trip so as much up hill as down hill so this will be more like 1hr riding , these batterys will start to sag like a Bast**d at and above 20A which will bring the voltage down as little as maybe 26v ( depends on internal resistance ) so this will then become 26v @ 20A this then only makes 520W ( a loss of nearly 200W! ) these batterys will only be anygood for upto around 20A max, I dont think you will even get 3 hours runtime if every thing is working correctly the absolute max run time will be around 1.5hours if the controller is limited to 20A and your running @ 36v . Its more than likely the the bms is limiting the current to only 8A and that is why its reported such a long run time but 8A@36v is only 288W personally I would not wast my money on these battery's for this application

Edited September 8, 2012 by gwhy

[awdrocks]

if its getting 4-4.5hrs of run time then the battery/16" can not be a great performer , expample: if you have a 500w motor and running at 36v then the controller needs to be limitied to around 20A ( this is acutally more like 700W ) so riding up hill only give you 0.5 hour with a 10ah battery but I normally look at a round trip so as much up hill as down hill so this will be more like 1hr riding , these batterys will start to sag like a Bast**d at and above 20A which will bring the voltage down as little as maybe 26v ( depends on internal resistance ) so this will then become 26v @ 20A this then only makes 520W ( a loss of nearly 200W! ) these batterys will only be anygood for upto around 20A max, I dont think you will even get 3 hours runtime if every thing is working correctly the absolute max run time will be around 1.5hours if the controller is limited to 20A and your running @ 36v . Its more than likely the the bms is limiting the current to only 8A and that is why its reported such a long run time but 8A@36v is only 288W personally I would not wast my money on these battery's for this application

Thank you and appreciate your input. We have the 12.5 and 16''. How do you think this battery would work for the 12.5''? My boy rides the 12.5 at full power everywhere and we would definitly not like less performance. But concidering the lead batterys taper down from beginning to end, do you think the above battery would still perform less then the stock batteries?

Our other option is to buy the EathX ETX12A:

http://www.earthxmotorsports.com/index.php/page_id/2

There are a few 12.5's out there running EarthX 36v's with no problems without any controller change ect.

I know usually there are no "easy" solution", but looking to get about a 1.5-2hr run time on a lithium battery that wont taper down in power in both the 12.5 and 16''.

We have done some solid riding on some trails that range from up hills, down hills, single trails, sand, rocks ect and we both get the EXACT run time its pretty perfect. He weighs 40lbs on the 12.5 and im 190lbs on the 16/36v and we get a solid 1hr 15min ride time or about 6.5 miles stop and go ride time.

I liked the Earth X batterys because they seem pretty maintanance free and we can just add batterys and share between both bikes.

Also I was under the impressions, that all lipos just ran 100% until the cutoff?

The guy who had the 4hr run time, I don't know about the performance, but even if they perform to "par" or better then the stock batterys.

Very much appreciate your imput.

[gwhy]

These batterys may just about be ok for the stock 12.5 as the controller will be limited to around 15A and the performance SHOULD NOT taper off like the SLA but it really depends if the manufacture is being absolute with the specs, ( many battery manufactures will slightly big up the spec of there battery's) .

the EathX ETX12A looks like it will be more suitable as the spec says that it has a cold crank current of 120A which will be fine for the stock osets and they also say they are 12ah , so a extra bit of run time over the stock battery. you will need 3 of these battery's to make up the voltage to run the 36v bikes. Any oset running 36v will be fine running 3 of these battery's as regards the controllers. To get the run time your after you need to be looking at using the EathX ETX18's ( any of the 3 types will do ) this will give you approx what you are after, or better still go for the 24ah ( but watch that the physical sizes will still fit into the bikes ). Lipos do still taper off ( maybe only 4-5v) but nowhere near as bad as sla but lipo do get to a point and the voltage will drop like a stone but if the battery has a bms then the bms should turn the battery off to prevent over discharge. those EathX batterys do look like a very good turnkey solution as replacement battery's for the osets for people that dont want to go down the soft pack lipos.

[awdrocks]

These batterys may just about be ok for the stock 12.5 as the controller will be limited to around 15A and the performance SHOULD NOT taper off like the SLA but it really depends if the manufacture is being absolute with the specs, ( many battery manufactures will slightly big up the spec of there battery's) .

the EathX ETX12A looks like it will be more suitable as the spec says that it has a cold crank current of 120A which will be fine for the stock osets and they also say they are 12ah , so a extra bit of run time over the stock battery. you will need 3 of these battery's to make up the voltage to run the 36v bikes. Any oset running 36v will be fine running 3 of these battery's as regards the controllers. To get the run time your after you need to be looking at using the EathX ETX18's ( any of the 3 types will do ) this will give you approx what you are after, or better still go for the 24ah ( but watch that the physical sizes will still fit into the bikes ). Lipos do still taper off ( maybe only 4-5v) but nowhere near as bad as sla but lipo do get to a point and the voltage will drop like a stone but if the battery has a bms then the bms should turn the battery off to prevent over discharge. those EathX batterys do look like a very good turnkey solution as replacement battery's for the osets for people that dont want to go down the soft pack lipos.

Thanks for the input.

[ninefives]

I like the sound of the simplicity with the Earth X solution - I see these batteries seem to be designed to replace starting batteries in sports vehicles where the weight is the key requirement. This means that their job is starting the vehicle, and the batteries are then topped up with the vehicle charging system. We tend to "deep cycle" the batteries in an OSET. I don't think that this is significant but just thought I'd mention it. The technology in the Earth X is Lithium Iron Phosphate. Reading the hobby vehicle forums seems to show that LiFe batteries are slightly heavier than LiPo but still much lighter than SLAs, don't have quite the same burst power capability as LiPos but are very simple and robust. I think that it may be a good solution. I read somewhere that the voltage of LiFe cells is a little lower when charged than LiPos @ 4.2v (in my boy's Oset I run the 36v with 10x4.2v LiPos giving good power without burning anything (been doing this for a year)!!) I have 25ah capacity which lasts about 6 hours of trials type use - ie stop start & trails on a loop.

Very interested to hear the results of a Earth X conversion.