pete_scorpa3 Posted December 1, 2011 Report Share Posted December 1, 2011 Firstly nobody HAS to leave their own country. Lots of people migrate all over the EU to where the work is or where they can better themselves. Do totally agree however with your final point and i dont know why if people feel so hot under their collar about it why dont they form a "Stop Allowed Trials Association" and run trials just for stop allowed enthusiasts with their own BTC ? Perhaps entry qualification would be the ability to perform a three point turn in a box 8ft square ? Also perhaps the member clubs could have an age limit of under 40's only ? applied to club officials as well as riders ? OK only joking but many a true word spoken in jest Hey I can turn a bike around in an 8ft sq by bouncing but it doesn't make me a better rider..... ohh I forgot, I'm over 40 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosey Posted December 1, 2011 Report Share Posted December 1, 2011 Turn your bike around! Requires a small room and a porcelain throne doesn't it ... 8ft square is more than ample! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizza5 Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 For the past 10 or more years our top riders have flitted between countries to ride their Championships Spain and Italy being the most, so why is it that the top riders from other countries aren't rushing to do our British Championship, sponsorship has a lot to do with it no doubt but it does make you wonder ''is our Championship that bad?'' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigwig Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 ) 2012 DATES The British Solo Trials and British Enduro Championship dates were agreed provisionally. In view of the current economic climate, the Committee took the decision to reduce the rounds of the Solo Trials Championship to six. Dave Willoughby reported that entries in the Championship were the best for a number of years and it was therefore agreed to keep to the same format as in 2011. Just found this in the minutes from the last ACU meeting held on 6th September. Interesting..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
for artie Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 (edited) Let's give credit to the companies who actually sell what they use in competition. Too bad Honda will only build a few works bikes while not providing better equipment to their customers ! Yes, like THIS FAKE official Gas Gas factory entry in the Dakar....it's a Yamaha with Gas Gas stickers on it!!! Sorry, I don't mean to hijack the thread but here in the US these jackholes are always bagging on the Montesa. They create a lot of negativity in our sport. Now to be fair I'll say something about No Stop.....the most important factor in our sport needs to be FUN....make the sections fun to ride and marked simply and get rid of the little boxes and "rat mazes" Edited December 2, 2011 by for artie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old trials fanatic Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 (edited) Hey I can turn a bike around in an 8ft sq by bouncing but it doesn't make me a better rider..... ohh I forgot, I'm over 40 I can't and i can't bounce either well i can't on me bike then again i can't stop and balance without falling over either Thats why i ride Pre65ish. All in all i think i'd better take up golf like rosey Edited December 2, 2011 by Old trials fanatic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
for artie Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 (edited) Achieving a clean with a non-stop ride is arguably more difficult as you only get one go, you have to plan a line and stick to it. Make a mistake and go off it and it will cost you marks. Allowed to stop, you can repeatedly correct mistakes by hopping back on line and achieve a clean. Which is why stop and hop sections have to more difficult in order to take marks - which is where the problem begins. Well said Woody. That is where the problem begins. A hopping section full of little boxes can only be enjoyed by a rider with those skills, but a no stop section can be enjoyed by all. Edited December 2, 2011 by for artie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axulsuv Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 Well said Woody. That is where the problem begins. A hopping section full of little boxes can only be enjoyed by a rider with those skills, but a no stop section can be enjoyed by all. That makes perfect sense to me !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sting32 Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 That makes perfect sense to me !!! Hey, when you "No Stop" zealots go and compete at other sports or activities, um, lets say Golf for example? Do you take out your "Flintstones" era rock headed 3 wood or driver, and leather wrapped ball, and then pine around and tell everyone you know, how it would be more fun if nobody can use techniques we've learned in the past 100 freaking years? Sounds stupid when you say it out loud, "Lets all go back to 1970's era rules... yeeeeaaaah" I golf, I can hear you scream, Hey he's choking up on the club, or making the ball spin backwards on the green, I cant do that, that is unfair and (not as fun)! Well, to me, This is what you are blabering about when the NO STOP zealots refuse to learn to hop and or the other techniques, but want the sections redone to suit you and your antiquated riding style. BTW, Dont you all already have a governing/sanctioning body for old style riding??? Start your own "old farts on old bikes sanctioning body" and if need be "old farts on new bikes" sanctioning body? and while you are at it, riding with helmets seems to be "newfangled" along with stopping and hopping, so lets sneak a vote to dissallow them... I mean they didn't wear them in the 1903 until about 1980. wow, I think some good old Bell helmet hats and wool stocking caps would be a boon for getting teenagers interested in riding antique rules and bikes? Quit trying to take trials back to the stone ages, quit trying to make the boyscouts do girlscout's crap It is just typical Horse Crap, Zealots dont wanna do it, and aint gonna do it, but to be competitive and "fun" to them, they are going to change the stupid rules for everyone else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camberman Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 (edited) Finally somebody is willing to tell it like it is !!! Mr. Kansas Sr Expert - You are my new hero !!! Edited December 2, 2011 by camberman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camberman Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 (edited) Yes, like THIS FAKE official Gas Gas factory entry in the Dakar....it's a Yamaha with Gas Gas stickers on it!!! Sorry, I don't mean to hijack the thread but here in the US these jackholes are always bagging on the Montesa. They create a lot of negativity in our sport. Now to be fair I'll say something about No Stop.....the most important factor in our sport needs to be FUN....make the sections fun to ride and marked simply and get rid of the little boxes and "rat mazes" Sorry if I hurt your feelings about the Montesas but letus face the fact that Tony Bou's machine is much further from the production bikes than the machines from the other manufacturers. While I am sure that all top team riders have some "works" parts on their machines the bikes from GG,Beta,Sherco and Ossa are MUCH closer to production bikes than the mega-dollar Honda/Montesa's ! We have all heard the vast amounts of money Honda has spent on these exclusive machines for many exotic parts that are not available to the public. Not that there is anything wrong with that, as they can afford it. The newest Raga Bikes from GasGas are Much closer to what Adam rides than any production 4RT is to Tony's machine ! All bikes have their problems as well. When I purchased a new 4RT in 2005 I had the bike for less than one month before it kicked back when starting and broke the mounting boss from the inner crankcase where the kickstart stop was attached - this after me having to replace the stop's mounting bolt as a factory recall. The bike was ruined and went back to the importer. The selling dealer refunded my money and I re-invested in my first of many Raga bikes, all which have been very reliable for me. Now I am not trying to say that any bike is perfect, but before you start calling anyone else here in the US a "jackhole" why don't you try to direct your own negativity somewhere else and realize that even your beloved Cota is not perfect!!! And at least our top riders here can compete in their own National Championship and still ride by the rules of the WTC ! And what is any different with the GG/Yamaha from the Montesa/ Honda - Haven't we all seen the RTL versions sold in Japan with Honda Stickers ??? Edited December 2, 2011 by camberman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
for artie Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 (edited) Sorry if I hurt your feelings about the Montesas but letus face the fact that Tony Bou's machine is much further from the production bikes than the machines from the other manufacturers. While I am sure that all top team riders have some "works" parts on their machines the bikes from GG,Beta,Sherco and Ossa are MUCH closer to production bikes than the mega-dollar Honda/Montesa's ! We have all heard the vast amounts of money Honda has spent on these exclusive machines for many exotic parts that are not available to the public. Not that there is anything wrong with that, as they can afford it. The newest Raga Bikes from GasGas are Much closer to what Adam rides than any production 4RT is to Tony's machine ! All bikes have their problems as well. When I purchased a new 4RT in 2005 I had the bike for less than one month before it kicked back when starting and broke the mounting boss from the inner crankcase where the kickstart stop was attached - this after me having to replace the stop's mounting bolt as a factory recall. The bike was ruined and went back to the importer. The selling dealer refunded my money and I re-invested in my first of many Raga bikes, all which have been very reliable for me. Now I am not trying to say that any bike is perfect, but before you start calling anyone else here in the US a "jackhole" why don't you try to direct your own negativity somewhere else and realize that even your beloved Cota is not perfect!!! And at least our top riders here can compete in their own National Championship and still ride by the rules of the WTC ! All true. Yes, the other brands works bikes are closer to production and yes the 4RT is not perfect and had a kickstart recall. No argument here. I see nothing wrong with "works" bikes. What I am ranting about is the endless anti-Montesa carping that comes from the Gas Gas camp here in the US. It starts at the top and goes down. Its ugly and negative. As for understanding this debate ....How many No Stop trials have you ridden? Have you ridden the SSDT? There is much value in what these experienced men have said here. There is a similar argument in Motocross VS Supercross. Many riders and fans prefer outdoor, grass roots, natural MX and some like Supercross. Am I a Flintstone because I want to see the Ryans duke it out on a natural track like Unadilla? No that is the "core" of the sport and moto people have embraced the roots of their sport. Edited December 2, 2011 by for artie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosey Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 (edited) Well the Montesa v's Gas Gas /'rest of the stuff' battle has certainly gone No-stop Works bikes? ... oh.. as in some (bikes) works better than others! Oh and... That fake official Gas Gas factory entry in the Dakar....The Yamaha with Gas Gas stickers. With a bit of luck the stickers may be reliable to last the whole event Edited December 2, 2011 by Rosey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
for artie Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 And what is any different with the GG/Yamaha from the Montesa/ Honda - Haven't we all seen the RTL versions sold in Japan with Honda Stickers ??? Montesa is owned by Honda. Gas Gas is not owned by Yamaha. Why doesn't Gas Gas use their own 450 in Dakar? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
for artie Posted December 3, 2011 Report Share Posted December 3, 2011 Hey, when you "No Stop" zealots go and compete at other sports or activities, um, lets say Golf for example? Do you take out your "Flintstones" era rock headed 3 wood or driver, and leather wrapped ball, and then pine around and tell everyone you know, how it would be more fun if nobody can use techniques we've learned in the past 100 freaking years? Sounds stupid when you say it out loud, "Lets all go back to 1970's era rules... yeeeeaaaah" I golf, I can hear you scream, Hey he's choking up on the club, or making the ball spin backwards on the green, I cant do that, that is unfair and (not as fun)! Well, to me, This is what you are blabering about when the NO STOP zealots refuse to learn to hop and or the other techniques, but want the sections redone to suit you and your antiquated riding style. BTW, Dont you all already have a governing/sanctioning body for old style riding??? Start your own "old farts on old bikes sanctioning body" and if need be "old farts on new bikes" sanctioning body? and while you are at it, riding with helmets seems to be "newfangled" along with stopping and hopping, so lets sneak a vote to dissallow them... I mean they didn't wear them in the 1903 until about 1980. wow, I think some good old Bell helmet hats and wool stocking caps would be a boon for getting teenagers interested in riding antique rules and bikes? Quit trying to take trials back to the stone ages, quit trying to make the boyscouts do girlscout's crap It is just typical Horse Crap, Zealots dont wanna do it, and aint gonna do it, but to be competitive and "fun" to them, they are going to change the stupid rules for everyone else? To summarize: if its old it must be worthless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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