Dear Mr Miller

[aawil]

having just got the regs for next years talmag trial the general rules make interesting reading , which if used on all classic trials would stop a lot of the trick bikes overnight, i assume that the t.a,l.m.a.g. will not object to me quoting from the regs, general . ignition systems, must be either conventional magneto or coil ign of the period. ELECTRONIC SYSTEMS WILL NOT BE ALLOWED. this one rule would be interesting if it was enforced, forks must be of a type manufactured or fitted before 31 dec 1964. with the general basis that engine,gearbox ,frame forks hubs ign and carburettor must be of apre 1965 type ,specials accepted providing they are of parts manufactored before dec 1964, as i am now not allowed to ride the talmag as i am riding a greeves trials outfit which being a twostroke is not eligible i thought i might offer my services to help out with the scrutineering, this would be very interesting,( i can see the arguments already ) if all organisers used this sensible set up and back to the classic one lap 30 to 50 miles with one route for all li would come out and ride a lot more and my old mate deryk would have a smile on his face,

[jon v8]

I have just received my regs for the Talmag,interesting that they require an AMCA day liecence - why ? No other AMCA trials I have ever ridden or organised have needed one...

The answer to getting old pre unit bikes back out is in the sections - nothing more nothing less.You can fiddle around all you like with classes and rules.The truth is that the,(Ageing) bulk of owners of these bikes are now scared off by trials that would intimidate them.Young people just don't seem to be interested in either fixing up or riding old bangers.Banning electronic ignition frankly is helping nobody.

While I was running Bath Classic trials I welcomed ANYONE who came along with a British bike,no matter how original or trick it was.(If I had my way their entry would have been free.)Put in sensible sections and spread the word around - people will come and ride them.

[aawil]

jon you get me wrong my solution is as yours. one route with sensible sections to suit the average clubman wide enough for us sidecar crews with a good ride between sections ,in fact just like the early sm series, which i thought was great to ride and also the friendships made are still valid , my comment about me helping out scrutineering was a tounge in cheek comment but it would be fun to exclude a (i think) majority of the bikes. i have given up riding my rigid panther outfit in the talmag as sitting rocking on the crankcase at the top of the steep climbs on lots of sections gets a bit annoying , i am sure when i started riding chairs 42 years ago this problem did not happen, so either my bikes have lost their ground clearance , or perhaps the organisers have made the sections harder ,i know the answer . will.

[laird387]

Hi jon and will,

Trouble is you are both right, from my lofty seat the majority of so-called classic sections have just got dafter - trying to set something slightly like a diluted modern section - but isn't that probably because they don't know any better - if you have only ever ridden a relatively modern machine you can have absolutely no understanding of the differences and difficulties of riding a classic British trials model.

At one stage I persuaded one club to get the young section plotters with Spanish bikes to 'see' a section in their mind's eye then get a mate to sit pillion behind them and try it - 'cos then at least they understood just what the weight difference meant.........

But we all know the problems of trying to persuade anyone in a club to set sections.

I know what the answer is, deep down, it needs someone with foresight to set to and create a new sport - call it authentic trials maybe - and start the trial with everyone on zero marks, then add 10 marks at scrutineering for every divergence from standard 'as manufactured before 1965' specification.............or maybe just gather a group of like minded friends and convert to a form of trail riding.

Just to remind you what the Talmag used to be like in the bad old days, here's an image from twenty-one years back - how many bikes like this will be in action next January at Hungry Hill? (And yes I do know it has rearward set footrests, an alloy oil tank, a chain tensioner, a novel front hub - and it might even have electronic ignition - 'cos I used to build an invisible electronic unit in an old Lucas magneto body when Lucas spares began to dry up - then on a business trip to Singapore found a dealer with a 'spares box' full of old Lucas magneto bits that he was happy to sell to me lock, stock and barrel because there were no customers with old British bikes any more, so could start rebuilding the mags correctly............)

Edited October 27, 2014 by laird387

[aawil]

it seems that we are all on the same side in this as i am cutting down on my work next year i will be in a position to offer help to any norfolk /suffolk clubs to lay out suitable sections that will ok for classic bikes and sidecars, in fact i think i still have a sackfull of red/blue/white section markers tucked away somewhere left over from my days as trials secetary of the north east london mcc, so if you need help just let me know .. will 01362 667859.

[laird387]

Hi,

If you would like to know more about how the Sammy Miller series has developed over the past twenty years, we are now running a regular feature in the digital magazine, ORRe, available only from this website, with hundreds of photographs from the earlier trials as well as up to date details and images from the current series.

Here is one example of a Triumph Tiger Cub seen many years ago, Simon Wynne riding in the 1998 Sam Cooper Union Jack trial, photographed by Mary Wylde.

Enjoy.