Condolences For Margaret ...

[steveo]

All politicians now are members of a co-operative with there main agenda squarely focused on remaining in power at what ever cost to anyone but themselves....

[b40rt]

I'm not debating that,

Dont think you can isolate the "woman" from her actions.

[hrc2002]

Hmmm, I think my joke got lost somewhere

[b40rt]

Hmmm, I think my joke got lost somewhere

Story of my life, only Ham 2 occasionally encourages me (in a patronising way, obviously)

[hrc2002]

Dont think you can isolate the "woman" from her actions.

But what about the trade unions, I'm sure they weren't so innocent in all of this?

[kmac]

Hmmm, I think my joke got lost somewhere

I got it. I even thought it was funny!

[b40rt]

But what about the trade unions, I'm sure they weren't so innocent in all of this?

Correct.

[toofasttim]

Apart from the good things she did (Mr Whippy) she destroyed many lives and community's.

How many lives did WSC ruin with his incessant warmongering and self belief that he was destined for greatness? Yet he went to the grave universally mourned. Thatcher did what was necessary. That she didn't see or predict all of the long term consequences of her actions was human frailty.

[b40rt]

Re WSC, the (failed) promises of a land fit for heroes gave birth to the unions.

I, naively, expect pm's to look to long term consequences.

[toofasttim]

Re WSC, the (failed) promises of a land fit for heroes gave birth to the unions.

Well sort of. Attlees post war govt was the first labour govt. But the unions had been around well prior to that and led to the formation of the labour party. I apologize if I'm being patronizing

I, naively, expect pm's to look to long term consequences.

In an ideal world yes. I doubt whether MHT went out to destroy and/or humiliate the working classes. Perhaps she had faith that UK industry would regroup and redirect itself after her demolition of the unions and the miners. If that was the case she was, sadly, mistaken as she was with the banks. One thing you cannot deny is that it was game over for UK mining. There was no coal left.

[b40rt]

Re WSC, the (failed) promises of a land fit for heroes gave birth to the unions.

Re-birth !

Still plenty of coal, environmental and politics rapidly killing it off however.

[toofasttim]

He he. WSC on Clement Attlee: "A modest man with much to be modest about.".

Re coal: Is there still plenty left? If there is I apologize for my erroneous statement. But was it economical to extract it in the early eighties? If not would it have been economical if the mines had been more automated?

[b40rt]

Thatcher wanted nuclear power, and got it, sort of. I'm not sure of the details, but she opted for gas cooled I think. 25% efficiency was about average. Coal has to be cheaper long term ??

(TBC)

[nigel dabster]

He he. WSC on Clement Attlee: "A modest man with much to be modest about.".

Re coal: Is there still plenty left? If there is I apologize for my erroneous statement. But was it economical to extract it in the early eighties? If not would it have been economical if the mines had been more automated?

This is my big disappointment from the thatcher years, whilst transforming the outdated industry was a must she lacked the vision that manufacturing is essential for long term prosperity, her government was happy to see steel and coal and cars be produced elsewhere. The most recent plants of toyota and Nissan and now triumph have proved we can manufacture profitably and manage efficiently, and had companies like Ford who now produce the iconic transit in TURKEY, been better invested and managed,the relience on banking may have meant that the collapse would not have hit us so hard. It is not the excellence in engineering we lack as the F1 is all here, its the value of it thats missing.

[toofasttim]

Dabster, sometimes a culture or society needs a serious kick up the a*** or, in management speak, a paradigm shift. Perhaps the UK was in a spot where it needed that? To see the old wood die and new take over when it was sufficiently mature? Labour, at that time, was pretty poisoned (as was management as we saw with the UK motorcycle industry).

B40: I have read about the gas cooled reactor and if memory serves it was a bad bet. The PWR is a much better option. BTW I am a nuke engineer but not of reactors.

Edited April 12, 2013 by toofasttim