None Stop! The Start Of The End! Whats It Solved? Rubbish.

[ironbelly]

Just seen Japan, None Stop lol, it's got to be the worst decision in Trials up to date, what on earth have they done to the sport, the riders are stopping, its making it more difficult for the observers, I found myself laughing while watching, it should be called, "None Stop well just for a second or two" this is why Trials is a minority Sport, because there are too many idiots in charge making bad decisions.

Progression is sometimes a backward step, this is one of those backward steps.

[funtrials]

Just seen Japan, None Stop lol, it's got to be the worst decision in Trials up to date, what on earth have they done to the sport, the riders are stopping, its making it more difficult for the observers, I found myself laughing while watching, it should be called, "None Stop well just for a second or two" this is why Trials is a minority Sport, because there are too many idiots in charge making bad decisions.

Progression is sometimes a backward step, this is one of those backward steps.

The only worse decision the FIM could possibly make would be to mandate that the bikes go back to what they had before the invention of the round wheel (...you k.now, the square wheels the cavemen probably used....don't put that past the FIM.....)

Edited April 28, 2013 by funtrials

[funtrials]

Let's boycott the British Round!

Let's boycott the British Round!

Let's boycott the British Round!

Let's boycott the British Round!

Let's boycott the British Round!

Let's boycott the British Round!

[funtrials]

Yes, it's SO MUCH EASIER TO OBSERVE NOW!!!!!!!!! (You just give them all a FIVE now because they all seem to still stop for a split second at one time or another in the in the section.....or you DON'T give them a five and make a complete farce of the so called "rule".)

I looked up the definition of the word "rule" in the FIM handbook, and it said "see the word 'guideline'".

[borus]

wow, that is hard to watch, I feel for the riders and observers and paying customers,

[lineaway]

Just seen Japan, None Stop lol, it's got to be the worst decision in Trials up to date, what on earth have they done to the sport, the riders are stopping, its making it more difficult for the observers, I found myself laughing while watching, it should be called, "None Stop well just for a second or two" this is why Trials is a minority Sport, because there are too many idiots in charge making bad decisions.

Progression is sometimes a backward step, this is one of those backward steps.

The scorers were too slack. And it did solve what they were after. The end of one man`s domination. Same as when the FIM came up with the all day dab. That was the `real` end of trials. History just repeating it self again. Wah!!!!!!!!!

[jj65]

No Stop - Moving, as long as the bike is moving, sideways, hopping the front/rear wheel then it would appear the FIM are perfectly happy that that is No Stop. I think the definition may have got diluted in the translation.

I like No Stop trials and clearly it will develop a new skill/style, but a system that is so open to interpretation by the FIM, organisers, observers and the general public is ridiculous. The rules should and must be clear and enforced with no grey areas, otherwise one rider, (either due to his status or popularity etc) will benefit from another, meaning the scoring and the championship is farcical.

I know it cannot be perfect, (as humans are involved and as per the previous stop allowed rules, which were quite ridiculous too, backing a stopped bike up as an example, which was ignored most the time) but to give our sport credibility, there cannot be "the benefit of doubt" element in a world championship. This isn't a club trial were talking about, it's a professional sport that people earn a living from.

My armchair opinion and solution is, 1 mark for every fault, you stop, 1, go backwards (a few inches), 1, foot, 1, hop the back/front wheel whilst stopped, 1, etc, etc, etc, up to a max of 5 marks per section, but the section must be laid out to be ridden No Stop with a time limit. So if you truly ride no stop, you win. I love trials, I ride, observe and watch, but I cannot help but feel we are all kidding ourselves if we think either stop allowed or no stop are better than one another, there both observed incorrectly due to fear/embarrassment/intimidation, whatever it is, its not right to have a championship that has rules that are not used to score riders, with the correct deserving winner, who has ridden the trial to the letter of the rule. As an observer, I would be very happy to mark under these rules (having had previous hassles from observing no stop and stop allowed trials). I'm sure there'll be plenty to pick fault with what I have suggested and quite rightly, as it only my opinion, but clearly stop allowed and no stop are far from perfect.

The whole point of having a winner, is surely that they have won fairly within the rules, not by gaining a lower score because of who they are, what team they ride for, or due to giving them "the benefit of doubt". I want to see the the best man win in a way that I, or anyone else can observe as a spectator, without that irritation of thinking, he stopped and got a clean. (I've just watched a vid of Bou at Montegi where he stopped several times and even rolled backwards on a water fall section and got a clean for it). I don't blame the observers, I've done it and sometimes I swear I'll never do it again after getting aggro, it's not easy when spectators are judging your assessment of a riders performance. Lets face it, their all volunteers, trying to do their best, no volunteers, no trial.

I must say I like watching the no stop riding so far, it's nice to see a new style that flows without all the long stops, it just needs tweaking and maybe not called No Stop. Clearly the FIM cannot change anything this year, but maybe next year it will be tweaked and renamed, so lets all just enjoy what we see from the best riders in the world.

Edited April 29, 2013 by jj65

[bilc0]

Let's boycott the British Round!

Let's boycott the British Round!

Let's boycott the British Round!

Let's boycott the British Round!

Let's boycott the British Round!

Let's boycott the British Round!

You rebel.

[kbtrials]

wow, that is hard to watch, I feel for the riders and observers and paying customers,

May suggest that Trialscentral reaches out to the FIM, Thierry Michaud, for a comment.

Questions I'd liked to have answered are,

1. Are you happy with the result?

2. Will there be professional observers sent to each competition to avoid subjective observing?

3. Exactly how will subjective ruling, less fascinating display of skill and lottery results (five for a stop is harsh and may in many cases judge the entire competition) sell more bikes???

(I do want this explained as I can't get my head around it)

4. Wtc riders has expressed unhappiness with the rule. it's now proven very subjective, motive is questionable - will you change/remove the rule?

A second article I'd like to see is one from someone who attended the WTc in Japan, was it as bad as the footage tells??

A third one would be from the riders. Did they like it or hate it??

[dan williams]

If you want to change it just sign up to check and enforce the rule as written. It'll change.

[eddie_lejeune]

it would be easy to fit a sensor to the bikes that would highlight the cessation of forward motion- for world rounds only

[geeman]

Have to agree with the comments the videos clearly show subjective scoring ,no way for the World Chamlionship to be decided no mater which rider or Team you support . I intended to go to the next round in the USA but if the videos are an example of what we will see then we will be missing seeing the best riders in the world riding at their best . I think the FIM will need to quickly revise their position and scoring .I will not attend a watered down version ,with the result at the descretion of the checkers and not the riders . What a shame it is to hear both the riders and the checkers having big concerns about the system we now have . I will be interested to see if the FIM respond !!!!! I guess not all change is good !!

[baldilocks]

No Stop - Moving, as long as the bike is moving, sideways, hopping the front/rear wheel then it would appear the FIM are perfectly happy that that is No Stop. I think the definition may have got diluted in the translation.

I like No Stop trials and clearly it will develop a new skill/style, but a system that is so open to interpretation by the FIM, organisers, observers and the general public is ridiculous. The rules should and must be clear and enforced with no grey areas, otherwise one rider, (either due to his status or popularity etc) will benefit from another, meaning the scoring and the championship is farcical.

I know it cannot be perfect, (as humans are involved and as per the previous stop allowed rules, which were quite ridiculous too, backing a stopped bike up as an example, which was ignored most the time) but to give our sport credibility, there cannot be "the benefit of doubt" element in a world championship. This isn't a club trial were talking about, it's a professional sport that people earn a living from.

My armchair opinion and solution is, 1 mark for every fault, you stop, 1, go backwards (a few inches), 1, foot, 1, hop the back/front wheel whilst stopped, 1, etc, etc, etc, up to a max of 5 marks per section, but the section must be laid out to be ridden No Stop with a time limit. So if you truly ride no stop, you win. I love trials, I ride, observe and watch, but I cannot help but feel we are all kidding ourselves if we think either stop allowed or no stop are better than one another, there both observed incorrectly due to fear/embarrassment/intimidation, whatever it is, its not right to have a championship that has rules that are not used to score riders, with the correct deserving winner, who has ridden the trial to the letter of the rule. As an observer, I would be very happy to mark under these rules (having had previous hassles from observing no stop and stop allowed trials). I'm sure there'll be plenty to pick fault with what I have suggested and quite rightly, as it only my opinion, but clearly stop allowed and no stop are far from perfect.

The whole point of having a winner, is surely that they have won fairly within the rules, not by gaining a lower score because of who they are, what team they ride for, or due to giving them "the benefit of doubt". I want to see the the best man win in a way that I, or anyone else can observe as a spectator, without that irritation of thinking, he stopped and got a clean. (I've just watched a vid of Bou at Montegi where he stopped several times and even rolled backwards on a water fall section and got a clean for it). I don't blame the observers, I've done it and sometimes I swear I'll never do it again after getting aggro, it's not easy when spectators are judging your assessment of a riders performance. Lets face it, their all volunteers, trying to do their best, no volunteers, no trial.

I must say I like watching the no stop riding so far, it's nice to see a new style that flows without all the long stops, it just needs tweaking and maybe not called No Stop. Clearly the FIM cannot change anything this year, but maybe next year it will be tweaked and renamed, so lets all just enjoy what we see from the best riders in the world.

this maybe worth discussion seems more practical if the judgemental aspect is less critical

[dombush]

Although I agree with many of the comments, can I suggest that we give it a few more trials to see how the riders and observers develop.

If it continues as many think the rules will change, we may learn some good aspects to go with the negative ones.

[jimmyl]

it would be easy to fit a sensor to the bikes that would highlight the cessation of forward motion- for world rounds only

How would this work