pete_scorpa3 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 I agree that the WTC should be for the best riders in the world to demonstrate their skils and provide a fair way to challenge those riders, whilst giving a clear winner at the end of the series. If going non stop for a year or two still gives us a real World Champion whilst making the whole series, and possibly the whole sport, more economically viable (and therefore sustainable) then that must be worth a try. If going non stop proves to be unpopular, then it is simple to change the rules back in a year or two, safe in the knowledge that it was tried and didn't work. Personally I prefer riding stop allowed trials, and prefer to watch non stop, but riding in both, I can honestly say it makes no difference to my finishing position. I also welcome and enjoy reading other peoples views on the subject, although I regret some of the unnecessary refrences made in the opening post. In UK ACU events, we still hae the choice which system to use, last year I ran our club trials stop allowed, this year I will be running them non stop. At the end of the season all concerned will evaluate what has happened. We may regret going non stop, we may not, but at least we've tried. Remember, this is a sport, most do it for fun, it's nothing more sinister. Pete 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 Balanced view pete but how will a rule change either way make our sport more viable? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr neutron Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 Balanced view pete but how will a rule change either way make our sport more viable? I've wondered if the move to Non-Stop wasn't simply a "Somebody do something, even if it's wrong!" type of deal by the FIM when it came out. Hard to see how it helps the sport. Most of us that like the sport of Trials (and have the time, money, & etc.....) will attend the WTC events, & still ride our local events regardless of the rules, won't we??? Jimmie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turps Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 Stop please, your frightening the dog ! Not sure if your allowed to stop in this thread or not Ross !!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billyt Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 The dog in the scenario is the FIM. Seems stopping is scaring them LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shercosi Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 having just watched the coverage of the American rounds I can honestly say that they have made it positively boring to watch plus I think that some of our top club expert riders could ride some of the sections. was thinking of going to nord view this year but don't I will bother would not want to pay out good money to watch that circus be better watching Jefferies trial at least I wouldn't think I had been robbed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
telecat Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 How many Centres are running "No-Stop" only Trials. Not Many. The Yorkshire Centre continues to hold out but to be honest I don't think any Centre around it runs "No Stop" at any level. Many tried it but reverted back to Stop. Makes the ACU and FIM look out of touch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzpete Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 Can someone please tell me how non stop makes the sport more economically viable. To compete at world level is very VERY expensive. The rules have changed not the cost. The Fim would be better off reducing the costs that they are in charge of. Licence, insurance, entry ect. The cost to go and ride your local trial has not changed, how will no stop sell more bikes. The argument of bikes are to specialised is just a joke, Road racers, enduro, mx are also specialised, they don't ride down to the pub (well not often) on there bikes. The non stop at world level is crap. non stop well stop a bit if you want I will turn a blind eye. We now have this farce that is not non stop or stop allowed. If you get the chance to see a endurocross in real life go. You will not be disappointed, fast exciting, crashing bashing full on racing, all on postage stamp in front of you Pete. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fracy Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 having just watched the coverage of the American rounds I can honestly say that they have made it positively boring to watch plus I think that some of our top club expert riders could ride some of the sections. was thinking of going to nord view this year but don't I will bother would not want to pay out good money to watch that circus be better watching Jefferies trial at least I wouldn't think I had been robbed I am sure that if you looked at the scores a little closer, you would see that the sections were not so easy. Perhaps for the top 3, but, I looked at the winners scores versus Jack Challoner and Pat Smage who were 10th and 11th....big gap there from them to 1st! Not so easy me thinks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b40rt Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 having just watched the coverage of the American rounds I can honestly say that they have made it positively boring to watch plus I think that some of our top club expert riders could ride some of the sections. was thinking of going to nord view this year but don't I will bother would not want to pay out good money to watch that circus be better watching Jefferies trial at least I wouldn't think I had been robbed I thought it was the idea to make it look easier, more accessible, to encourage people into the sport ? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breagh Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 Rules maybe the issue ,it's the overdevelopment of the bikes that's caused this situation. Too light,too much grip,too much power,too much suspension and useless for anything other than short circuit trials. Only since the advent of modern trials tyres have riders been able to stop and pull away. Before that stopping wasn't really an option even if the rules allowed it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzpete Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 That's why its called a trials bike. If breagh theory is true why do we see riders on enduro bikes hopping on the rear wheel, balancing then starting off again and doing all the trials tricks with mx type tyres and around 100kg of bike . Skill levels have changed Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveo Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 (edited) I am sure that if you looked at the scores a little closer, you would see that the sections were not so easy. Perhaps for the top 3, but, I looked at the winners scores versus Jack Challoner and Pat Smage who were 10th and 11th....big gap there from them to 1st! Not so easy me thinks! Steve, I’m sure the comparison of penalties lost in any trial for the riders mentioned would show a similar gap no matter if Stop or No Stop was in play. The decision to implement No Stop for the WTC after the British 2012 experience that saw such wide spread discontent amongst the riders was ignored. Its plain to see that no matter in what form they try to shuffle the rules, time limits, no minders, not being able to walk sections on the day of the event, the skill of the top riders will always shine through. The very questionable reasons given for these rule changes like gaining more competitors, to sell more bikes or to entice more spectators is just plain nonsense. To me the saddest part is the element of marker influence on a result. The old term that is always brought up at marker training and marker briefing on the day of a Trial is be consistent with your marking. Sure this works well on many grey areas during an event, BUT as seen on some clips when a faultless ride is witnessed and really is deserving of a clean score, that riders advantage has been negated by a markers leniency. It only takes one error of judgement with scores he has given to riders who should have probably have been pinged a five, to turn a winning ride into a second or third placing, and in effect, the best rider has been cheated. It is very unfair for riders and it places to much responsibility on markers when the rule is not strictly enforced for what ever reason. What I find so annoying is the pretence after each Trial that all is well. These top riders should be allowed to ride in the manner the sport has progress through and in the manner they have trained and honed theirs skills so the world can see the magic they possess and their ability to make these bikes do the unimaginable. If that means backing up or rear wheel hopping, nose wheelies or what ever other skill they possess to make it to the ends cards clean in their allotted time, lets witness it. If that means embarrassing the rest of the field, so be it, after all they are the best in the World on these machines and they should be given the opportunity to display their talent Edited June 2, 2013 by steveo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shercosi Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 my point was it looked BORING !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and would not part with my hard earned cash to go and watch it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie_lejeune Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 my point was it looked BORING !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and would not part with my hard earned cash to go and watch it i agree it looks boring, very boring indeed as does the btc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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