dadof2 Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 New Honds now available 4RT factory £6799 4RT standard £5699 But the real bargain is the 125 CRF motocrosser with electric start at £1,999 Why then can't they do a useful 250 / 300 cc trials bike for around the £3000 mark? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copemech Posted October 24, 2013 Report Share Posted October 24, 2013 A sweet little TLF 175 mono would be too simple and easy! Only sell a million! Duh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted October 24, 2013 Report Share Posted October 24, 2013 New Honds now available 4RT factory £6799 4RT standard £5699 But the real bargain is the 125 CRF motocrosser with electric start at £1,999 Why then can't they do a useful 250 / 300 cc trials bike for around the £3000 mark? Simply put worldwide they will sell shedloads of these so economies of scale. Trials bike at 3k you try making money out of that? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totalshell Posted October 24, 2013 Report Share Posted October 24, 2013 because when you say useful you mean'' performs well enough so that i do as well on it as any other brand'' so that means you have to pay at least as much as nany other brand and as Honda company policy is 4t only that adds to the costs thus 6k. it isnt cheap and yet is suspect they dont make a penny from them.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizza5 Posted October 24, 2013 Report Share Posted October 24, 2013 As Dabster said they will sell a lot more CRF 125 models and that particular motor is probably used in other bikes? The 4RT motor is similar and derived from the CRF 250, but not the same and not used in any other motorcycle hence the huge cost Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jj65 Posted October 24, 2013 Report Share Posted October 24, 2013 New Honds now available 4RT factory £6799 4RT standard £5699 But the real bargain is the 125 CRF motocrosser with electric start at £1,999 Why then can't they do a useful 250 / 300 cc trials bike for around the £3000 mark? I think you'd probably find the 125 as an entry bike, is subsidised by all the other bikes in the mx range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted October 24, 2013 Report Share Posted October 24, 2013 or is just a cheap motor from previous years? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxbikes Posted October 24, 2013 Report Share Posted October 24, 2013 Honda are always expensive,ive had a few cars and motorcycles the quality is very good,and resale values are also very good.see how much old tlr and rtl250 go for.look at used 4rt go for compare with other trials bikes.what bike is winning trials last few years?you get what you pay for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinshocked Posted October 24, 2013 Report Share Posted October 24, 2013 (edited) - Honda will probably produce only about 2-3 thousand Montesas and and 100 thousand CRF 125's. Economy of Scale. -the Montesa is fuel injected, liquid cooled, 4 valve, aluminum framed, DID rimmed, Showa suspended limited production, non profit.... specially built for competition bike. -The CRF 125 is air cooled, carbureted, rear drum brake, 2 valve, steel frame, 200 lb, low cost entry level bike, that appeals to the masses. It makes zero business sense. That is why NO other major motorcycle manufacturer is makes Trials bikes. Those that want one should consider themselves lucky that these bikes are available. Edited October 24, 2013 by twinshocked 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shyted Posted October 24, 2013 Report Share Posted October 24, 2013 Devils advocate here! Whats available and what you see is what you want . If something akin to an overbored XL185 engined trials bike with basic technology became available,how many of us would buy it ?(What do you mean we already did)! How many realize Honda's wanton domination of the motor cycle world? They may put out a myth they don't make money from the trials scene , but i'd like to bet they don't lose it either. Don't forget their business don't revolve around one bike scene. Great subject this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted October 25, 2013 Report Share Posted October 25, 2013 how much do you think Bou gets? how much do you think Fuji gets? The montesa hrc racing team per year costs how much? a myth? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted October 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 25, 2013 It is probably Repsol money paying for the above not Honda money. TY 250R - Arguably the best all round trials bike ever built, cost around £2500. Lots sold. Yamaha then replaced it with the TYZ, price £4600 upwards. sales soon fell, Yamaha effectively pulled out of trials shortly afterwards. Had Yamaha just tweaked the TY it by bit each year avoiding large retooling cost the trials world may now have been a very different place. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldilocks Posted October 26, 2013 Report Share Posted October 26, 2013 Good point. I thought the 93 and 94 models from Gas Gas were fantastic however when I rode them tben jumped on a friends 270yam the marks lost were about the same although the Gas Gas did feel much better. On other sections result may have been different Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosey Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 Mono yam was about £1850.. may have been cheaper in 1984 (although I'm convinced it first appeared in 1983?). They did tweak it over the years, engine cases changed extra engine mounts, stronger footrest mounts.... etc. etc. .. all tweaks then the front disc (radical change). It may have finished up at £2500. It never struck me as being that well made until I had Spanish bikes and I realised that the Yam was well made! I'm not sure how well made the Honda is now. I'm sure times have changed. Not so many people used to change bikes every year. Also bikes looked the same year on year. The Yam sold in tonnes in the early years as it was miles better than the rest to ride. It never really had any significant victories either. TYZ was erm different. The Scorpa with TYZ Yam engine was a great bike. Well suited to most riders requirements... didn't sell that many though. One thing that seems to be true of the more recent scene is that if there was a low cost bike, nobody would want it. Everyone now wants the bike the stars are riding then spends money calming down the power delivery to make it rideable for normal riders 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie_lejeune Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 the thing is that old now the tooling costs must be recovered so why not reduce the price 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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