laser1 Posted February 3, 2014 Report Share Posted February 3, 2014 Dadof2 - thanks for clarifying your position. I think it makes sense in many ways, but I dont agree with your final outcome being as matter of fact as you state, but who knows. Anyway, thanks for the answers to my questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted February 3, 2014 Report Share Posted February 3, 2014 Dabster - I am beginning to wonder if you make your living supplying lightweight parts? Take a look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lifan_Group If these cheap products were that bad this company could not have expanded at such a rate. Vast numbers of these cheap bikes provide reliable daily transport in developing nations. I can remember when British manufacturers (BSA, Triumph etc) laughed at those little Japanese step thrus, saying its Ok lads we will not bother with those we will concentrate on "real bikes". Next thing the brits were begging for government handouts before going bust. Why was trialling more popular and more new bikes sold when they were heavier? Why do Mont / Hondas command much higher second hand values than lighter bikes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canada280i Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 I think there a difference in riding cheap bikes on the road or a dirt track in a developing country at a relatively sedate pace than hammering one off road. Yes they are ideal cheap transport for commuters but for them to develop a reliable rugged off road machine would increase the costs exponentially. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 I think there a difference in riding cheap bikes on the road or a dirt track in a developing country at a relatively sedate pace than hammering one off road. Yes they are ideal cheap transport for commuters but for them to develop a reliable rugged off road machine would increase the costs exponentially. Apparently dadoff you know even less about trials and its market than I thought. One sentence you say Montesa Honda has the best re sale the previous that cheap Chinese bikes are the way to go. In one sentence you say the demise of the British bike market was allowing imports to get ahead the next advocate it? But Trials was more popular in the 70's because bikes were heavier? Really? What you fail to grasp/overlook/avoid is what people really want and choose to buy, based on your own experience/anecdotal evidence/clips from history. The leap from FIM minimum weight to the mass production of Chinese trials bikes is one that will not happen. As I have said before, several times, reliability is not the massive problem you think and if it were then sales of bikes of the more reliable brands would far outweigh any others. This is not the case, moreover the most popular brand (in sales) is probably the gas gas and its about as light as it gets and the one you have termed unreliable on more than one occasion. The Chinese will not produce a bike which will sell 1000 units worldwide. This really is the last time I try and explain it, the fim weight limit cannot change bike manufacturers sales, a 2k bike (even if it were possible) isn't wanted if its heavier and not like the current crop, and mostly to turn the clock back to heavy bikes is never going to happen as the vast number of second hand bikes would be obsolete, nevermind a whole set of rules and club officials drafted in to cope with the management of the dadoff weight rules ensuring bashplates were thick enough frames welded at weak points and extra bearings in the gearbox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Anybody got a smilie of a dead horse being kicked?? 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guys Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canada280i Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 nice!.......beat that f**ker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 (edited) Dabster, its hard to tell if you are deliberately misquoting my posts or you just can't read properly. Where EXACTLY did I say cheap Chinese bikes are the way to go? I note you have avoided answering why the heavy Mont / Hondas have better resale values and why trialling was more popular when bikes were heavier. As for gas gas reliability they are certainly loosing customers because people believe they are unreliable often with the good reason of personal experience, Malcolm Rathmell (Sherco importer) is probably rubbing his hands with glee at the number switching to his marque. Not so long ago I felt there was a fair chance my next bike would be a gasser, thinking I could probably live with the potential gearbox problems, but after seeing frame breaks and water pump problems as well I have decided against a gasser. Edited February 4, 2014 by dadof2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Canada 280i. I have seen some "Chinese" bikes that were c--p but also some that have proved to be rugged and reliable despite abuse and lack of maintenance that would quickly wreck any European trials bike. Whether a Chinese manufacturer ever chooses to make a trials bike only time will tell, but no one should underestimate the rate at which their quality in engineered products is improving. Sooner or later at least one (if Mont / Honda is not already) of the European manufacturers is going to start sourcing significant numbers of components in the far east and the others will have to follow suit if they are to remain competitive cost wise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canada280i Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 I believe Xispa was a chinese Sherco copy so possibly they already do or did make one, however it was certainly not in the 2k price range. I don't doubt that one day they may come up with something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 THANK YOU!!! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie_lejeune Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 what about the old XPA whatever happened to it, did one ever get made? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axulsuv Posted February 6, 2014 Report Share Posted February 6, 2014 Lay it to rest now ... it's out of our hands ... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b40rt Posted February 6, 2014 Report Share Posted February 6, 2014 Lay it to rest now ... it's out of our hands ... Was it ever in our hands ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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