hencam Posted January 18, 2014 Report Share Posted January 18, 2014 Hi All, i have been fortunate enough to increase the Bultaco collection this weekend. A couple of questions though and hopefully some useful guidance. I purchased the bikes because both my father and i love them, he had them 50 years ago when he was 17ish and for me as an affordable twinshock bike they are my chosen mount . i am not looking to restore to perfect condition just to the extent funds will allow and to be rideable in twinshock trials Anyway one of the bikes is a white framed, Bultaco 340, it has what appears to be normal Bulto forks but on one side has no pinch bolts, Is this correct or is it a replacement fork leg that has not had holes drilled or the slot cut?? It has a Engine number 199******B fitted which has 6 gears which i believe is correct, but the engine with it is no. RM198****** B this i believe is a 250 engine is it not? It has an alloy air box fitted, with a single large rubber bung with a tag on the side and 3 hexagonal bung holes in the top, was this standard? The bike has a plastic tank although i believe it should be Alloy?? Does anyone know where i can get an alloy one from or will an alloy tank off a 198A fit? i have found a few posts that say the correct Alloy tank had squarer sides and was shorter than the 198A if i can't find an alloy tank would i be better off with a Plastic or Fibreglass type from shed works?? were the Bultaco 175cc anygood, as always any advice or help gratefully received and if anyone has an alloy 199B fuel tank please contact me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smelling123 Posted January 18, 2014 Report Share Posted January 18, 2014 Hi, Well done, more Bultacos can never be a bad thing. Answers to some of the questions... Some of the later fork legs were like that from the factory (mine is the same). 199B is the 340 6 speed engine, 198B is the 250 (and will only be 5 speed) - actually rarer than the 340. The standard airbox's were fibreglass so looks like you have something a little more special. Maybe you could post some pics in the Bultaco forum? Some came with plastic tanks and aome alloy so your plastic one is most likely what it came with from the factory. The alloy ones, were as you say squarer. A 198a tank would fit but you'd be better sticking with your plastic one for originality. You can get plastic and alloy from InMotion. It's rare to see an alloy 340 tank - lots of pennies if you can get one! cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bondy Posted January 18, 2014 Report Share Posted January 18, 2014 hi i bought a alloy tank from inmotion i got it for 1 off my 199Bs only for show it came unpainted not cheap but will look nice when theres paint .and decals on it. as smelling says your beter off with the plastice tank. i have a 198B they are 5 speed gear boxes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted January 19, 2014 Report Share Posted January 19, 2014 Just give us the last 4 numbers on the frame it may help. If its late 3000 or even 4000 it may be one of the last and from your descriptions it is. It may have an alloy head steady, and the forks came like this on the subsequent italjets so its a kind of upgrade! Only thing is the discrepancy between engine and frame numbers, it may well be genuine and that's my guess as the factory was using what it had. Amal carb and 5 speeds confirm its a 250 at a glance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hencam Posted January 19, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2014 Hi All, many thanks for those ultra quick early responses. i will get some photos and post them. on the 340, yes it has an alloy head steady, it has the 340 engine fitted, Bing carb etc, somebody appears to have cut and welded about an inch into the exhaust pipe above the cylinder head, neat job and nicely done, but why??. The "spare motor" is the 250 198B, i will obtain numbers and scratch the paint off and post frame numbers as well. The 340 has seen some hard use, but what a beautifully smooth motor, even with the Bing which i had been led to believe were not the best. It is always nice to have something a bit special?? if indeed it is??. however to be honest my interest is in it for the bike it is, not who may have owned it. i have been in this position before with BSA Victor GPs etc and to be honest people spend more time getting hung up on who owned it and who didn't and telling you what you have not got than riding the bike . For us it will be just another Bultaco we can shower love and attention on and an excuse to pester Dave, Robin and the team at Inmotion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted January 19, 2014 Report Share Posted January 19, 2014 My guess is about 4100 for frame and non matching engine number around the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hencam Posted January 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2014 Well here they are, all 3 of them. 1 off nicely restored 198A, 1 off nice little 175 sherpa, with a 50" wheel base, is that correct or has someone ridden into a wall, needs restoring, but a beautifully quiet little motor?? Probably the best of all for me is the 199B, matching Engine and Frame no. JB199 14292-B. she is a bit scruffy but rides beautifully, this bike was apparently on ebay a few months back, it has 2 condensors fitted, an 1" added in the front pipe, an alloy air box, although the one fitted is clearly wrong being from a 1976 ish bike i believe. if anyone recognises it or has any info please let me know i will probably leave the 198A as she is, the 199B will need a sympathetic restore, i would like to find an alternative tank, i don't like plastic and have heard the decals won't stay on, will a 198 style alloy tank fit?? what shockers would be considered an upgrade, new betors?, i don't want to spend a fortune as my riding ability is not worthy of it? Also although the bike is running ok, i think a few quid spent on the carb would be worth it, or possibly a new carb, AMAL, MIKUNI or OKO???? The one giving me the most trouble on a decision is the 175, were they any good? it is a short wheel base and seems to have a higher ride height. or I suppose I could turn it into a 250 and find a different frame, any ideas or suggestions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pschrauber Posted January 25, 2014 Report Share Posted January 25, 2014 (edited) The 175 is nice, even to ride, it's not very powerfull compared to the 350 and 250 but works and will do any job that has to be done during a classic trials. I personal would replace the tank against the plastic model. I too believe in quite good technical order you will have most fun with 175cc Bultaco. Edited January 25, 2014 by pschrauber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted January 25, 2014 Report Share Posted January 25, 2014 The 175 used a 250 frame, it's basically a 250 bike sleeved down to 175. Easy to convert back to 250 with an overbore. Yes the wheelbase is correct because the 250 frames between '76 and '78 differed from the 325. They had a bend in the front tube just under the headstock and had shorter forks. They handle well and turn a bit quicker than the 325. From '78, they went back to using the same frame for the 250 as the 325. 199b - If you use an alloy tank from the model 198 you will also need the corresponding seat. That shape tank had a different slope at the rear from the plastic tank, so the front of the seat has to match. But they won't look right on the 340 at all. They only came with the plastic tank or a one-off UK alloy tank which was a squarer, different shape which is not the same shape as the plastic tank (or therefore, the alloy tank that is currently made in Spain) Shedworks do a fibreglass ethanol proof tank the same shape as the plastic tank but about 1" slimmer. Either in blue gelcoat finish or plain for painting, both options allow the use of decals (you're right, decals won't stick to the plastic tank) The exhaust looks standard. The weld you've pictured is normal. The 199b airbox is unique to the b model and works fine. The 199 and 199a used a different airbox which was considered restrictive and the factory riders used to replace it with the older type. Someone seems to have done the same to your bike for some reason. If ultimate performance isn't needed, a pair of steel bodied Betor shocks should do the job as they work reasonably well and are a reasonable price. If the bike runs fine I wouldn't waste money on a new carb, especially if you're not using it in serious competition. If you do want to fit one, a 28mm OKO (not the powerjet version) works well. I have one on my 340 and it only needed a slight decrease on the pilot jet to a 39 from stock settings. They're about £60 off ebay. I only mentioned not a powerjet version as mine is the normal carb, so I don't have jetting for a powerjet as they are different I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b40rt Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 I was told by a 175 owner (from New and still owns it) that the crank was different to the 250, so not as easy a swap ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 I couldn't say specifically that it wasn't, but I'd be surprised as the 175cc model 221 is just a renumbered 250cc model 190 with the capacity reduced to 175cc by sleeving down the bore size. The stroke is still 60mm. Originally produced for the rental market as in some countries rental bikes were restricted to 175cc. Difficult to see Bultaco producing a one-off crank when they could just resleeve the cylinder, given their financial problems as well at that time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hencam Posted January 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 Hi Woody, Pschrauber thank you for your replies to my post, I will contact shedworks, just not sure on the whole Ethanol thing and with the tanks being £350 ish would hate for it to bubble and start to dissolve. I may have to bite the bullet and live with the plastic one. On closer inspection the 340 bike requires a little more than light restoration! it has one or two other interesting features such as a Titanium bash plate and Titanium snail cam adjusters!! the photos don't show it but there has definitely been an inch added in two places in the front pipe, once about 3" from the exhaust port and then again straight above this where the pipe passes under the fuel tank, I have 4 other 79 front pipes here and none have these welds. Thank you for the info on the 175 geometry, was there a reason why they made the bike 2" shorter for the 76-78 Sherpa 250 and then back to the full 52" for later models. with modern sections becoming tighter and tighter perhaps a short wheelbase bike would be useful? Along with the bikes I picked up a spare frame I will post photos, it does not have the usual Bultaco frame number it is just digits, 100**** from what I can remember also the frame has no swan neck but when laid on top of a standard 79 it is again shorter like the 175 frame with the s/arm pivot being approx 2 " further forward. I find it all quite interesting, especially when most people say 'oh yeah all Bultacos are the same!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinnshock Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 I was told years ago that one of the mods done by Reg May was to add 1" sections to the exhaust near the cylinder and then above to add 2" length increase to the main pipe. Not sure if this mod was worth it but if Reg May did it I suspect others would also give it a try. Stuart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hencam Posted January 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 27, 2014 Hi All, more photos of the odd Bulto frame i have acquired, as always any help guidance very much appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bult360 Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 Bultaco used the no 100 to start thier prototype / development bikes serial nos followed by 3 other nos , never seen or heard of one as high as 717 though and i was under the impression this stopped around 1973/4 , think one of motocross rider jim pomeroys frames was stamped in to the high 200s and that was around 72 ish,they only made a few bikes each year stamped 100 xxx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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