aids Posted February 25, 2014 Report Share Posted February 25, 2014 Hi I have been away from trials for around 14 years and just started back riding again. On coming back to trials I have seen the recruitment at club level for observers, as not changed, its difficultI ! As I have been away so long if the idea as been discussed before - sorry Just an idea - Self Observing Each section positioned at the end on a post/tree at handle bar hight, a punch, as riders we have own score cards, (similar used in the Nationals back in my day). when the rider as ridden the section, they punch they own score card, on sections that do have an observer they can use the punch card system. I feel this way more people will come to watch the sport not in fear of been roped in to observe. If a club know they are going to have problems getting observers, they could lay out a self observe punch card system. At club level we are not going to be the next works rider, most are out for the enjoyment and exercise, let the Centre and National trials sort them out. Un observed sections: You don’t know where the board is on arriving, is it at the start or at the end cards or up a tree, behind a rock. Passing the board along the queueing rides breaks your concentration before you ride also mates giving mates better scores. (Those who would score them selfs better will only be cheating themselves - its a club trial not a World Round (its NOT about the winning but having FUN at club level, its a hobby). Problem What do you do about club championships - that's when cheating will happen! just to get your name on a cup! Rider numbers are getting smaller, what's the point been a club champion of that club if that club is no longer around. (Put the resources/money that would go to buy the cup/shield in to club funds to get the club better equipped) PS I have organised and set out trials in the past, I know how difficult it is, do you do 8 sections and not 12, cos you won’t get that many observers. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cleanorbust Posted February 25, 2014 Report Share Posted February 25, 2014 Some clubs do use a self observing system, where groups of four or so ride round observing each other. Not over-popular in my experience, can give rise to some questionable scores. Also wouldn't suit me too well as I like to spend longer inspecting a section than most riders. Other clubs pay observers (a tenner in the case I am thinking of) and never seem to be short of manpower. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mick Posted February 25, 2014 Report Share Posted February 25, 2014 Our club trials are self marked, we have cards that we take round on a lanyard and mark ourselves. As the trials are meant to be fairly relaxed we don't get a problem with people cheating. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slack Posted February 25, 2014 Report Share Posted February 25, 2014 I think that every rider who rides should take their turn at observing,the observers up here in the north east are really good at offering their services.But when the weather is bad you can understand why a lot of people don't want to do it,so come on guys do the right thing and take your turn at picking up a board and helping the sport because when the regulars decide not to come any more that's when the sport will suffer. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guys Posted February 25, 2014 Report Share Posted February 25, 2014 At our club each rider has to observe one event a year. We have about 4 regular observers and because we've got 6 non-stops, we need the extra 2 riders to observe. If you observe, you get the maximum points you would otherwise get if you won the event. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelly1 Posted February 25, 2014 Report Share Posted February 25, 2014 mates giving mates better scores. you've not met my mates laugh point call me fat and give me a five 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biffsgasgas Posted February 26, 2014 Report Share Posted February 26, 2014 3D in eastern NY self checks. Every one gets a Twinkie as a trophy up until the great Twinkie shortage of 2013. Its a gentlemen's/gentlewoman's sport. They get it and treat as one. Won't work in a cut throat competition. Honesty has a lot more to give over dishonesty. --Biff 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_t Posted February 26, 2014 Report Share Posted February 26, 2014 We have so few riders and no observers we really have no choice but to self check. We typically all ride the first lap together to observe each other and do the point and laugh thing then we ride the remaining laps in smaller groups or on our own. I collect all the score cards at the end and post the results on the internet the following day. I have never been to an event that had actual observers but I might try and make the WTC championships in Quebec this year to see what it is like... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr neutron Posted February 26, 2014 Report Share Posted February 26, 2014 I probably ride only 10-12 events a year. Two of them are traditionally "Observed", while the rest are Group Checks. I much prefer the "Observed" type, but defintely understand why we're pretty much forced to do the Group Check deal. I've seen one example of some cheating, and I think it was dealt with tactfully. But I'm certain most scoring "discrepancies" are typically the type where a rider exits the section, stops his bike, talks with other riders for a minute or two, and then forgets what score he earned in the section he completed only minutes ago. Most of us are older, and probably forget to zip our pants up half the time....... I've gotten way over the "competitive" mentality a good while back. I no longer ride for score or placing high; I just try to have the most fun I can..... Jimmie 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted February 26, 2014 Report Share Posted February 26, 2014 mates giving mates better scores. you've not met my mates laugh point call me fat and give me a five Heh heh, at a national a few years ago a rider was complaining to the NATC rep that my buddy and I were biased and gave a local rider more time. He picked the wrong guys to accuse as everyone the NATC guy talked to had the same reaction. "Them? Give a local rider a break? Are you serious? They're vicious to the local riders." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suzuki250 Posted February 26, 2014 Report Share Posted February 26, 2014 I think it should be compulsory for riders to observe 2 or 3 trials a year, if you don’t you should be refused a licence the following year & black listed Surely its not that much to ask riders, after all it keeps the sport going? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted February 26, 2014 Report Share Posted February 26, 2014 Yup drive away the casual rider so the clubs lose money on events because of too few riders. That'll work like a charm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy Posted February 27, 2014 Report Share Posted February 27, 2014 (edited) In MOTA we have a system set up that any one can ride the events and recieve an award for placing in the top 3 for that event. But If you want to be elligible for a year end Class Championship Award you would then need to complete the following criterea: 1. Be a member of one of the MOTA Clubs (real easy ask "can I join _____ club?") 2. must work a minimum of 2 events per season (observe, set up sections, "run the sign up table" etc..) This system seems to work pretty good because many riders see the hosting club members working the event and decide (or feel guilty) that they too want to give back to the sport to keep it running. All the riders have their own card that gets punched that they take around the course themselves Of course if the hosting club is low on members than there is a request for more observers and on occasion we have had the odd "self check" section with a punch hanging on a post at the end of the section. Edited February 27, 2014 by zippy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suzuki250 Posted February 27, 2014 Report Share Posted February 27, 2014 (edited) Yup drive away the casual rider so the clubs lose money on events because of too few riders. That'll work like a charm. Nothing like a self ob trial for driving new riders away! Casual riders should have to provide an observer if they don’t have a licence Should riders expect someone else to do all the work all the time? Maybe the sport could do without those sort of riders? Edited February 28, 2014 by suzuki250 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aids Posted February 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2014 Thank you for your comments, looks like the Riders over the pond have it sorted, It must be us English that put our heads in the sand and hope one day it will all come right. A more professional approach would help, out of the 5 club trials only one had a pre start (with a car horn) Riders briefing about: number of sections / laps / dangers, places not to go etc. (If I can remember back in the 70's this alway happened). Every motor sport as some kind of rider/driver briefing before the start, why not us! To bring new young riders (and Parents) in to the sport we have to be more organised ,if they see these no command / structure to the event, we are not the only motor sport available on a weekend Trials organisation need to address this problem (when all us older riders have retired (again) they will be on one coming in to fill our places) and the sport will be lost - no bike, clothing, sales the knock on effect is large Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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