guys Posted September 4, 2014 Report Share Posted September 4, 2014 I guess the rear rim looks like an Morad Akront Style High Shouldered type. If I'm right it was a common replacement in those days. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmartin247 Posted September 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2014 The guy say's in his advert that it requires a piston, rings and a rebore, so not sure what the story is regarding the rest of the bike. That is why i am trying to find out as much information as possible as i do not fancy a mongrel of a bultaco. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bambam_n_chunx Posted September 4, 2014 Report Share Posted September 4, 2014 At almost 40 years old and the owner doesn't know anything about it chances are it's only any good for spares or will need fully sorting to be any good in a trial. You have to ask how much and why you want one. If it's to use and you haven't much experience with a spanner I'd buy a good one off someone in the know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breagh Posted September 4, 2014 Report Share Posted September 4, 2014 Hi John,my advice would be even if you got it free it would be a killer unless money was no option. This old 340 I've got which I trialled up until a fortnight ago is costing me serious money and that is just to get it running half decent. Probably could buy a 2012 Beta for the money it will be costing me and it will still look like a banger. On the upside whatever I spend I will likely get back and I have the pleasure of dealing with Bultaco UK,very nice people. Anyway who wants a Beta. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmartin247 Posted September 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2014 At almost 40 years old and the owner doesn't know anything about it chances are it's only any good for spares or will need fully sorting to be any good in a trial. You have to ask how much and why you want one. If it's to use and you haven't much experience with a spanner I'd buy a good one off someone in the know. To be honest i don't really need it as i have two montesa cota 247's on the go at the moment, one which is nearly finished and one that i still have to start!! I just like the look of the bultaco's but i think this one is to much of a gamble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bondy Posted September 4, 2014 Report Share Posted September 4, 2014 (edited) that 's the fun bit. Edited September 4, 2014 by bondy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmartin247 Posted September 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2014 (edited) Hi John,my advice would be even if you got it free it would be a killer unless money was no option. This old 340 I've got which I trialled up until a fortnight ago is costing me serious money and that is just to get it running half decent. Probably could buy a 2012 Beta for the money it will be costing me and it will still look like a banger. On the upside whatever I spend I will likely get back and I have the pleasure of dealing with Bultaco UK,very nice people. Anyway who wants a Beta. Hi Alan, like you say the twin shocks are a good investment and if i were to sell the Cota 247 that is nearly finished i know that i would make a healthy profit, but that is not my intention. I plan to come along to the wobblers when the bike is finished and join the club, i spoke to a few of the members at the Dunfermline trial two weeks ago when i was seeing the lay of the land with Willie. Looking forward to seeing your bultaco when it is ready. Cheers John. Edited September 4, 2014 by johnmartin247 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike350 Posted September 5, 2014 Report Share Posted September 5, 2014 Aside from the cc - and I've never heard of one being greater than 340, I think your question is "Which 199, A or B". Mine is a 199A - the standard 325cc Sherpa. What we all really want though is a 199B with 6 gears and some other mods. If that's what you are looking at then you really want to get there quick and put some money down! Best of luck. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoodie2 Posted September 5, 2014 Report Share Posted September 5, 2014 (edited) I can put you out of your misery as it's me that's taken it on. Sorry John but you might be better off! It is a 199 frame but the motor is an 85 which is a 71 Alpina 250 I think. Definetely 5 speed anyway. It's a collection of good but mismatched parts. Now I just need to decide what direction to go with it. Edited September 5, 2014 by hoodie2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmartin247 Posted September 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2014 I can put you out of your misery as it's me that's taken it on. Sorry John but you might be better off! It is a 199 frame but the motor is an 85 which is a 71 Alpina 250 I think. Definetely 5 speed anyway. It's a collection of good but mismatched parts. Now I just need to decide what direction to go with it. No problem hoodie2, I had made my mind up last night that it was not for me, just to much of a gamble with the lack of engine details etc. I would be tempted to break it up as tank and mudguards look good as do the forks. Cheers John. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoodie2 Posted September 6, 2014 Report Share Posted September 6, 2014 I think I might build it back up modeled on a 198. The motor is PM 8506182 so I'm thinking it could be a late 85 and it has the square barrel. The frame is an early one at JB19900124. Are the motors that different between 74 and 78 apart from the neater rh side case? I'd like to put it back to silver frame and red plastics also so might be some blue plastics up for grabs. The tanks mint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted September 6, 2014 Report Share Posted September 6, 2014 When you say are the early / late motors different, in what respect do you mean. Yours is an Alpina motor so it differs from the trials engine anyway, one is a trials engine, the other a trail so the porting may be different and the gear ratios are different. So you're not comparing like for like. In terms of power, the later square barrel 250 was a bit sharper than the older round barrel - both have enough. I don't think gear clusters are a straight swap between early and later engines as shaft sizes and some gearbox bearings differ. Also, the model 85 Alpina had a round barrel and head so if yours has a square barrel it's from a later bike, so could be Sherpa or Alpina. Richard Allen of Allen's Used parts had a 198a rebuilt motor for sale on his website http://www.allensusedtrialsspares.co.uk/#/bikes-breaking/4560010283 Or there was a 199 motor on ebay recently that didn't sell - you could make him an offer http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bultaco-Sherpa-Twinshock-Trials-Engine-Model-191-350cc-/161403086006?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item25945fa4b6&nma=true&si=SxeP2mc0uVIYU15V0QdsSiNuIEw%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557 Early and later clutch cases have a different profile and fit the profile of the crankshaft weight. If they aren't a correct match the case fouls the weight and won't mate up. Weights are interchangeable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoodie2 Posted September 7, 2014 Report Share Posted September 7, 2014 Thanks Woody. Think I need to spend some time sorting out what I have today. Definetely want to build a trials bike so it looks like I need a motor. Hadn't realised the Alpina had a different gearbox. Do you know if the alpina used the same forks as the Sherpa or do I need to check that out also? Cheers Hoodie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted September 7, 2014 Report Share Posted September 7, 2014 Not sure I follow you on the forks question as your forks are Sherpa. You have a 199 Sherpa with an Alpina motor so the motor is your only issue The early Alpinas such as the model 85 had the same front end, appearance and dimensions, as the Sherpa of the same era and I'd bet the damping was the same too as it was basically a Sherpa with different gear ratios and a dual seat - possibly ported differently but not 100% sure on that. Later Alpinas were completely different, their design and appearance departed from the Sherpa and the forks are totally unsuitable for the trials bike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bondy Posted September 7, 2014 Report Share Posted September 7, 2014 like these spare engines. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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