metisse Posted October 31, 2014 Report Share Posted October 31, 2014 I have an Ariel that since the engine was rebuilt many moons ago run on castrol R. It has to come out for a last minute trial on Sunday and I have no Castrol, will it harm it to just mix whats left in the oil tank with a normal 10/40, or do I need to drain it all out, or does it need to flushed / cleaned throughout before I add another type of OIL. I am sure I read somewhere that it could damage the engine if care wasn t taken when changing from Castrol R. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suzuki250 Posted October 31, 2014 Report Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) Never Mix R with any other oil, or you will scrap your engine! You would have to give it a very good flushing before adding any other type of oil. Your best bet is to find some more Castrol R Edited October 31, 2014 by suzuki250 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totalshell Posted October 31, 2014 Report Share Posted October 31, 2014 vegetable and mineral should never mix.. never. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted October 31, 2014 Report Share Posted October 31, 2014 Castrol R, or any other vegetable oil is not the right oil for a trials bike. Give the engine several flushings with flushing oil (any cheap high detergent diesel oil will do for this) and then switch to a straight grade oil, SAE 40 or 50 in summer, maybe SAE 30 in Winter. Ordinary 10w40 or 20w50 will do for a one off ride (warm the bike up gently) http://www.smithandallan.com/products/transport-classic-and-vintage/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suzuki250 Posted October 31, 2014 Report Share Posted October 31, 2014 Nothing wrong with using Castrol R in a classic 4t Trials bike, but be very careful if you use flushing fluids or oil as they don’t mix with 'R' I’ve only ever swapped oils after a full engine strip and clean Your best bet is buy some more ‘R’ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted October 31, 2014 Report Share Posted October 31, 2014 http://www.castrol.com/en_gb/united-kingdom/products/cars/classic-oils/classic-engine-oils.html The above is worth a read, also http://www.advantage-motorsport.co.uk/castrol-r40-engine-oil.html?gclid=CK-CzLfC18ECFQ3LtAodpF8AXw I do not know of any manufacturer who would advise Castor bean oil for a 4 stroke trials engine and most would outline several disadvantages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laird387 Posted October 31, 2014 Report Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) Hi, When I was restoring Ariel HT models I had a pile of scrap engines that had been run on Castrol 'R' then had a top up with a selection of mineral based oils, which I used as a source of bits that had escaped the 'disaster'. Like many I liked the slight whiff of 'R' so my own Ariel had a thimblefull of 'R' in the full petrol tank, which gave the required effect without what the doctors would cite as 'side effects'........... For the scrambles and grass track crowd, different story - but totally different type of engine use. I never used 20-50 or 10-40 oils, always just straight mineral oil, 30 weight in winter, 50 weight in summer - my engine, and all its tolerances had been designed when only single weight oils existed......... Edited November 1, 2014 by laird387 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metisse Posted October 31, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2014 Thanks for the replies, being in France its quite difficult to get castrol R, even harder at short notice. I wanted to check before I did anything hasty and I am glad I did. I have managed to source some at short notice, whether it gets here in time is another matter. Out of interest, the bike has always been run on R, its done many many trials as well as Nationals including Scotland and never missed a beat . It has been laid up for several years and after a minor fettle runs as good as ever, so I am happy to leave it as is. Thanks again to althoughs who replied. Bon Soiree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted October 31, 2014 Report Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) "Manufactured using specially selected additives to prevent rapid deteriation through oxidation. Its tenacious affinity for adhesion to metal surfaces, even when these surfaces are subjected to extreme temperatures, provide excellent anti-sze properties - an important consideration with highly stressed engines running at peak revolutions. In common with all SAE 40 oils, it is relatively viscous when cold; circulation may, therefore, be sluggish in the colder weather immediately following start-up. For this reason, care should be taken to ensure that the engine is thoroughly warm before stressing it heavily. It is a "one meeting" only lubricant. Fresh oil should be used at the commencement of each meeting and drained at completion. Vehicles should not be stored indefinitely with these products remaining in the crankcase." The above is taken from the site of a castrol R type oil supplier. I used to use these oils for Kart racing and still would but we use to strip and clean the engines every meeting and throw the petroil mix away once it was 3 days old. I have also stripped 2 and 4 stroke engines that had used R type oils for extended times and they were badly gummed or wrecked. If I had a bike I valued that had been laid up for some time with R in it I would certainly try very hard to check for gumming and satisfy myself it was clear before running it. PS - Laird, I think you have mixed up winter and summer Edited October 31, 2014 by dadof2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laird387 Posted November 1, 2014 Report Share Posted November 1, 2014 Hi, Thanks dadof2, posting corrected. Must have been that Al Tseimer interfering again.............. Deryk Wylde Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janvixen Posted November 1, 2014 Report Share Posted November 1, 2014 Hi - I've just joined as a new member and noticed this thread. I used to run Inter Nortons on "R" many years ago, and have lots of memories of it - used properly, it will leave beautifully clean engines inside, caked with burnt-on gunk on the outside.... But it's a fabulous lubricant. The problems are that mineral oil will simply not "wet" any surface that has had "R" on it - so while you can actually change from mineral oil to castor with a single dose of any flushing oil, you can't go back the other way without some serious internal cleaning with several changes of a good flushing oil - preferably an full engine strip. If you leave "R" standing in an engine, not only will it gum the rings up, but it has a definite appetite for digesting case-hardened surfaces, leaving things like cams and bearings covered in black erosion that makes you cry... On the other hand, "R" has a fine reputation as cough syrup, many old-time riders used to swear by it - tastes quite nice, actually! If you can't get Castrol "R", then Morris Lubricants of Stoke-on-Trent make excellent 30- and 40- grade Castor Oil - said to be as good as Castrol, and I used to use it exclusively many years ago, so would recommend it. Look up "Castor" on their website: www.morrislubricantsonline.co.uk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted November 3, 2014 Report Share Posted November 3, 2014 janvixen's post has an interesting comment about old castor attacking case hardened components. Castor oil is Hygroscopic (water absorbing) and once it has absorbed water it becomes acidic. This acid then attacks carbon at the grain boundaries in hardened steels or cast iron. I have never seen really bad examples of this, what I have seen far more often is just dirty gum that stops fresh lubricant reaching bearing surfaces which effectively run dry, overheat and cause more charring of lubricant before failing completely. Same acidic corrosion can happen to fuel injection components in your car if you run cheap bio diesel without a regular flush of mineral diesel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guys Posted November 3, 2014 Report Share Posted November 3, 2014 Why use an oil that has so much disadvantages when there are other perfectly suited oils available I wonder. The previous owner of my Bultaco used Castrol R as two stroke oil and I've seen the mess it leaves behind. Castrol has got better stuff in their range. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted November 3, 2014 Report Share Posted November 3, 2014 I think the attraction towards castor oils is historical and they still are very good lubricants, the best castors being as good or better than the best synthetics when at the limit. When I first had any interest in motor sport, 2 wheels and 4 everything ran castor oil and karts still do. Because of it widespread use in racing it probably leaves the impression that it is the ultimate engine oil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naichuff Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 Vintage bikes that use R have a total loss system If you use a recycle system (oil returned to tank or sump) Put some on a copper coin and it will clean it It is time to change it R was designed when nothing better was available for racing Oil technoligy has moved on since then 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.