guys Posted November 9, 2014 Report Share Posted November 9, 2014 Just take a good look at the topics here, concerning defects, on this forum of the brand you want to buy, and you can make your own mind up. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldilocks Posted November 9, 2014 Report Share Posted November 9, 2014 Take a look at ALL of the bike specific forums. None are empty. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted November 9, 2014 Report Share Posted November 9, 2014 Andrew, it was gasser every time for me up until the Pro, so very relevant to me, seems things went downhill from there, lots of problems from what I have seen from other lads compared to pre 2001 bikes. I would love to have another Gasser, always gave done, but being bitten so badly tends to leave a very bad taste in the mouth. that 2002 pro was trouble and possibly for a few years after, but its 10 years on from that now. happy to lend you my bike for a trial anytime see if it lets you down! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guys Posted November 9, 2014 Report Share Posted November 9, 2014 (edited) Take a look at ALL of the bike specific forums. None are empty. Whom said they were ? Sensitive subject it seems. Edited November 9, 2014 by guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 (edited) Contrary to Nigel's interpretation 9 I don't not advise buying a gasser. Gear selector spring Baldilocks # 12. Shercos still do this on the 2014s, only about £5 parts and an hours work fortunately. I often wonder why all trials bike manufacturers especially GG and Sherco do not fit a sprung face cam mechanism to protect the gear change system. I am actually quite sad to criticise GG gearboxes as when working properly a GG is a very very good bike. In my opinion the damage to GGs reputation was done mainly in the period 2004 to 2008 and the faults were made worse by the cost of parts and GG UKs refusal to look favourably on failure on low use bikes not long out of warranty. Quite a lot of the riders affected had various makes of bike dating back to as early as 1970s and never had a gearbox fail before (or after). It was these riders who will never touch a GG again. Beta (J Lamkpin) replaced stators, frames and other parts well out of warranty. Newer GGs the "gang" have had, 2010 125 gearbox "selector chain links" failed, 2011 125 water pump failed, new piston + barrel needed, 2011 125 frame broke, 2012 125 clutch release bearing failed and wrecked £500 of gearbox that ingested rollers. 2012 300 main bearings and kickstart failed. As far as I am aware there has been no design changes to cure the "selector chain link" failures the split needle roller failures (not listed above) nor strengthen the kickstart. The rollers in the clutch release can loosen sufficiently to fall out of their cage after only a few hours running. In theory they are trapped in situ even if their cage wears but in practice they do get out at times. Edited November 10, 2014 by dadof2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 I dont know why you keep banging on and on and on with your slating of the gas gas. Whilst no one doubts your gangs experiences these are anecdotal and totally unsubstantiated or objective. Many many more have had far more good experiences than bad. If and its a big if they were even close to your supposed suggestion of not being any good why would so may, Dougie lampkin 7 times world champ included (when he had the choice of any bike this year as out of contract) choose a GG in scotland. Recently there have been notable failures of 4rt's up there so nothing is infallable. just a small suggestion dont go out in Buxton after dark will you. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldilocks Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 (edited) The £5 for a spring isnt the issue, its when the broken bit gets picked up by the clutch basket / primary gear, that will be more than a fiver. We all have our views but the above wouldn't stop me buying another sherco they are a good bike. All im trying to point out is that none of them are actually bullet proof and people could be a bit more objective when someone is asking for advice. Edited November 10, 2014 by baldilocks 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted November 12, 2014 Report Share Posted November 12, 2014 (edited) No problem going out in Buxton after dark, all the GG fans will be too busy fettling their bikes to be out and about. Both myself and a friend had JTXs for a number of years and they were 100% reliable. But since the pro there reputation for reliability has become seriously tarnished. Seeing what happened to friends who bought Pros meant we never did. If posts listing GG failures upset them then they need to fix the problems. In fact those problems were not the only ones the GGs had, some of those bikes also had water pump seal and brake problems. DLs choice of bike. Top line riders bikes which are only used for a short period of time may be adequately reliable but that is no proof that they will be reliable for club riders who may use them many weekends and practice in between over 2 years or more. If GG are so confident in the quality of their product why do they not match or exceed Ossas 2 year warranty? Edit. Just to show its not just GG who don't always get things right I have seen 2 Betas that have had front brake failure as a result of minor falls recently. The brake assembly rotates on the handlebar and snaps off the very thin hydraulic hose fitting by it hitting the handlebars. The fitting needs beefing up and its exit from the master cylinder repositioning. Edited November 12, 2014 by dadof2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lineaway Posted November 12, 2014 Report Share Posted November 12, 2014 I was going to agree with the Pro comments, then you ramble on about levers rotating during crashes and that is the factories fault? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted November 12, 2014 Report Share Posted November 12, 2014 No problem going out in Buxton after dark, all the GG fans will be too busy fettling their bikes to be out and about. Both myself and a friend had JTXs for a number of years and they were 100% reliable. But since the pro there reputation for reliability has become seriously tarnished. Seeing what happened to friends who bought Pros meant we never did. If posts listing GG failures upset them then they need to fix the problems. In fact those problems were not the only ones the GGs had, some of those bikes also had water pump seal and brake problems. DLs choice of bike. Top line riders bikes which are only used for a short period of time may be adequately reliable but that is no proof that they will be reliable for club riders who may use them many weekends and practice in between over 2 years or more. If GG are so confident in the quality of their product why do they not match or exceed Ossas 2 year warranty? Edit. Just to show its not just GG who don't always get things right I have seen 2 Betas that have had front brake failure as a result of minor falls recently. The brake assembly rotates on the handlebar and snaps off the very thin hydraulic hose fitting by it hitting the handlebars. The fitting needs beefing up and its exit from the master cylinder repositioning. Dadoff I dispute your anecdotal evidence and theories based on JTX thats 15 years ago for crissake. To dismiss Dougies choice of bike regardless of time spent on it is to do an injustice to the great mans integrity.He had a failure on another brand at the scott and chose a gasser instead in most peoples minds that would count for something. you also seem to be missing the fundamental point that if your argument held any real truth why is the gasser the most popular bike. Is everyone of these riders wrong and youre right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b40rt Posted November 12, 2014 Report Share Posted November 12, 2014 I was going to agree with the Pro comments, then you ramble on about levers rotating during crashes and that is the factories fault? Could it be "designed" out ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve_earle Posted November 12, 2014 Report Share Posted November 12, 2014 Edit. Just to show its not just GG who don't always get things right I have seen 2 Betas that have had front brake failure as a result of minor falls recently. The brake assembly rotates on the handlebar and snaps off the very thin hydraulic hose fitting by it hitting the handlebars. The fitting needs beefing up and its exit from the master cylinder repositioning. Beta used to use Grimeca brakes but have recently seen them with the new type AJP/Braketech units the same now fitted to Sherco, Ossa, JTG, Montesa, Scorpa, probably Vertigo and guess what Gas Gas too. I have seen a fellow rider break the front one on his 2014 4RT a month or so ago, The fittings are smaller with 10mm bangos and thinner pipes and parts are not on the shelf yet at some dealers. The master cylinders are also very light and fragile. So basicly all the trials brands have the same units now so all the factories are at fault!!. I Ride a Gasser again now but I'm not biased, You can't have bikes this light and expect them to be perfect, and to be honest and no disrespect to people on here but I read various posts and there are a lot of bikes maintained by people who don't have a clue what they are doing. But on the other side of the coin there are people here too that really know their stuff and you rarely see them on here with problems. What we need is a good Spanish brand but built in China under supervision. These days you can buy a brand new 125 road bike, that is now very good, much better built than the 5 major trials brands for quality and best of all they RETAIL for about £1200. Makes you wonder what the real mark up is on a Trials bike? And yes I know they are built in small numbers but with £4500 profit in them they don't need to sell alot so you can see why new brands are starting up in what appears to be an owercrowded, specialist market. Clever buisness people dont throw this much money in just for passion about trials. So what I'm getting at is most brands are poor but we love the bikes when they work and I will continue buying junk and be happy with my junk as with proper maintenance, I have never retired due to the bikes fault in over 4 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted November 12, 2014 Report Share Posted November 12, 2014 (edited) Reply to lineaway #24. Levers rotating on the bars is not the factories fault, its been happening to off road bikes for ages and is a useful method of preventing bits snapping. Unfortunately it now seems that in an attempt to lighten and miniaturise components the hose fitting is weaker and located too close to the handlebar (at least on the rise and bend fitted to Betas). A small amount of lever rotation which would not have done damage previously now necks the brake line off. Dougie - is the bike really his choice or did he not sign some sort of deal with GG to ride there bikes in enduro, trials etc on an occasional basis and coach Raga. Perhaps the best post on this topic is Guys #16. If you look through there you will see GG have a large number of gearbox problems, whereas other marques have very few. The question still stands - Why don't GG offer a better warranty? perhaps the answer is they like to make money from a large mark up on spares. See http://www.trialscentral.com/component/attachments/download/1743 This is a fairly typical entry for trials in this area and a quick count shows GG to be no more popular than Beta or Sherco. What I do know is that a few years ago were put off Beta because of Stator failures. Now because of the various GG problems riders (in this area at least) are moving away from GG with Sherco probably the main beneficiary. I do not dispute that GG are popular and they are good to ride, and for some riders the riding experience on a GG is sufficient to overlook potential reliability problems particularity if they intend to replace them frequently. But GG would sell quite a few more if they were more reliable. Going back about 8 or 10 years a major GG dealer refused to sell any more TXT50 boys because of the negative effect their lack of reliability was having on their reputation. They were so displeased they sent their remaining stock back to GG UK. Edited November 13, 2014 by dadof2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fracy Posted November 13, 2014 Report Share Posted November 13, 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted November 13, 2014 Report Share Posted November 13, 2014 Statistics can be used to prove anything if you look hard enough. I would respectfully suggest you choose a national trial,ssdt,scott or 3 day or something not very close to Birks for a more realistic general view, or at least more accurate. I could post an entry list for a Derbyshire trial and show that the GG is way more popular,etc etc. Gas Gas Boys were not made by Gas gas, at least the engines and gearboxes weren't so perhaps you could clarify what your point is. No one will/does take any credence in your points or arguments if you make fundamental mistakes in your mission to trash a perfectly decent bike. And just to correct you again in case you missed it Dougie is contracted to Vertigo in 2014. He chose a Gas gas for his own reasons. Raga factory etc finished in2013, try to keep up.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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