cabby Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 How about this for a cost cutter. Sell direct from the factory,no importer (sorry JS) or dealer. Just make to order and sell on line direct to the door. I would be quite happy to do this specially as i've never had an issue with any new bike and that's a lot. No ideal,but this is the way things are going. How much would you save too? £3700 for a factory replica from the factory, importers are making a fair whack selling them at 6k a pop, granted there is import duty but still approx 1200 - 1400 per bike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 I think you would find that importers are making a fair bit less than that. Add to that the overhead of holding parts inventory and dealing with government regulations on importing motor vehicles, liability insurance, property insurance, theft insurance... Why would ANYBODY be involved with trials? Why? Because they love the sport which is why it's such a slap in the face to be lambasted for profiteering off the sport. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
africanjon Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 Anyone know how "merged" Ossa are with GasGas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 (edited) What Atomant wrote was "Do you remember Sir John Harvey Jones looking at failing companies and seeing how they can be turned around." I knew what Atomant meant but I felt it worthwhile pointing out what actually happened. There has been too much short term fixing and apparent achievement only for it all to unravel afterwards. Regarding Ched Evans, plenty of people share my view that he has done his time and should be free to return to his former employment. It will be interesting to see the result of the review into his case when it is complete. The verdict may yet be overturned. The GG press release on TC when read carefully suggests the situation may be terminally serious. The two key sentences say there has been failure to reach an agreement and production stopped. Couple this with the effect this situation will have on prospective purchasers and things do not look good. My guess is they will have to cut back on those large trucks and rider support. I can remember when Honda UK had to severely cut back its road racing to reduce costs to counter the treat from grey import sales. Despite my previous criticism of GG gearbox quality and other over light build defects I hope they (and OSSA) survive but they may have to move to a business model more like Jgas. Regarding Asian women, Well an Asian selling their "product" for the right price is likely to be sounder financially than a Welsh slapper who gives it for free whilst drunk. Edited January 24, 2015 by dadof2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ham2 Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 I think it more likely you'll be buying China or India manufactured trials bikes soon.......... Dan, Are you aware that a company called Xispa have already gone down that road and it was a cul-de-sac? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazybond700 Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 Who is going to risk buying a new Gasgas now tho? Surely new orders are going to dry up due to the uncertainty of the company! They havent until now... And it has been going for years like this actually... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazybond700 Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 How about this for a cost cutter. Sell direct from the factory,no importer (sorry JS) or dealer. Just make to order and sell on line direct to the door. I would be quite happy to do this specially as i've never had an issue with any new bike and that's a lot. No ideal,but this is the way things are going. How much would you save too? I quess it will cost more at the end. You need to give service etc, need sales people, and transport etc etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazybond700 Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 Anyone know how "merged" Ossa are with GasGas? http://www.gasgasmotos.es/en/news/481-gas-gas-motos-sa-and-ossa-factory-sl-join-for.html http://www.enduro360.com/2014/01/23/featured/gas-gas-ossa-merge/ http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/news/gas-gas-ossa-merger/ http://blog.motorcycle.com/2014/01/24/motorcycle-category/off-road/gas-gas-announces-merger-ossa/ I would say quite merged Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadof2 Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 Manufacturing in Countries such as China and India is very difficult and unpredictable for the component volumes required for the trials market. Good quality parts can be made in these countries but a rigorous quality assurance scheme has to be in place and low volumes do not justify the cost of this. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 Dan, Are you aware that a company called Xispa have already gone down that road and it was a cul-de-sac? Ah yes Xispa. Do you remember a near bankrupt company called Apple? Xispa went down because the few people who bought them reported them to be rather substandard. It won't be an instant change. First small suppliers will manufacture in China. Foot pegs, handle bars, bolts then it will move up the food chain to brake assemblies and pistons and then major components like forks and shocks and at some point the overseas factories will be making the jump to full production and since you will already have been using the stuff they manufacture only with a different sticker the difference in quality will be pretty minor. Besides, if that's all you can get your options are going to be pretty limited. I'm not saying I want this to happen. I love my beautiful hand crafted Beta with all its hand crafted Italian warts. But the day is coming when to survive these manufacturers are going to have to look for a cheaper option or the cheaper option will happen without them. Think about it. This is a discussion of the largest trials bike manufacturer being insolvent and what pops up? A post about how we're paying too much for our bikes. Seriously? Some basic financial acumen about importers and dealers. There is a business model most of the electronics component manufacturers use now based heavily on distributers. Why is this significant? Because the distributers buy inventory and for a markup have it on hand for customers. This is a virtual warehouse and production buffer for the manufacturer. Consider this, a manufacturer has to negotiate a deal with a company for brake lines. If they can't buy enough brake lines for the production run they have to pay a cost penalty because they get any economy of scale. If they buy enough to cover required parts for ten years on that model bike they will probably get a price break but they have to pay the money up front for that additional stock, they have to pay to store it and ship it and at the end of each year pay taxes on any unused because it is an asset. This is where the importers and dealers are critical to the survival of a factory. Importers and dealers will typically try to keep an inventory of parts around knowing they will have the same overhead concerns as the factory but it is spread around to a much larger degree. This allows the factory to have more price leverage with suppliers. Eliminate the importers and dealers and you lose any price advantage from "cutting out the middleman" as the manufacturers now have to pay higher prices for each part which eventually gets passed back to you. And you now have to wait for somebody in Spain to send it to you. And returning it if it's defective? Have fun with that. More dealers is better for all involved. There is one more aspect to the more dealers equation that has nothing to do with financials but much to do with the future of the sport. You may have noticed that clubs seem to spring up around small local dealers. This grows the sport by growing what's called SAM (Serviceable Available Market). Dealers are a critical point of contact for many new riders. The more local dealers the easier it is to get local knowledge. Where to ride, who else has a bike, can this be fixed. I think that the death of local dealers is one of the main reasons the sport is contracting. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sectionone Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 The GG USA site lists over 100 "dealers". The one nearest to me doesn't have anything GG related, not even a poster. The ones I do use for parts don't stock GG specific parts, only inexpensive generic items like brake pads, levers, grips, etc. Parts always get dropped shipped from the parts importer and sometimes they have to order it from Spain. I don't see the need for a dealer when I can just call the parts importer directly. I heard that the only requirement to be a GG dealer is to sell 2 bikes a year. Most of these dealers are doing it as a side business or to get personal bikes at wholesale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 Yes that is the new model and its failure becomes self fulfilling. I think if you called many of these "dealers" you'd find they were once much more involved but have now pretty much given up only keeping the dealer moniker to get a discount on bikes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nottoogood Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 Re the "future of GG". Obviously Gas Gas has a tough, but not impossible future. What about the other brands? Honda is irrelevant re this. Ossa also a bit irrelevant for an entirely different reason. Sherco? Beta? I would suspect both a bit better off....Sherco mildly some and Beta even more so.....agree? JGas...hanging on by a fingernail? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breagh Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 Dan,it's the dealers that grow round our club anyway,3 new dealers locally since we started 5 years ago. There's always new bikes showing up at our trials. The reason is we push it hard at grass roots because the new lads are keen and spend money. if it wasn't for the clubs few bikes would get sold,our club does more promotion than any dealer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 Yes but it is a symbiosis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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