shipdamite Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 Hello, the chain and sprockets finally gave up the ghost so I fitted new matching 12/51 and a 428 chain. the chain has the same number of links as the old (stretched) one, but even on the longest adjustment, the chain seems tight to me. the old set up saw the tensioner rubber resting on the swingarm, whereas now, the gap is forefinger thickness. This seems the norm from what google images tells me, but to me it seems really tight, but it seems to ride better. I am used to enduro bikes, where the chain hangs like the proverbial hammock. what do you do and is the forefinger gap about right? I dont want to bust the gearbox! cheers Andrew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old trials fanatic Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 Sit on the bike and with your full weight on it and the chain tensioner not tensioning the chain there should still be approx 1" of free flex in the chain. Well thats what i do and it works for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4stroke Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 With the bike supported, remove the rear shocks and raise the back wheel until the swinging arm holds the wheel furthest away from the engine sprocket. Adjust the wheel so that there is a small amount of chain slack. When the wheel is lowered back down and shocks put back on, the tensioner will take up the extra slack. Take note of the gap between rubber pad and swinging arm and set to this distance when wheel adjusted. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipdamite Posted May 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 Thanks both. OTF - 1'' of free flex is just about all that there is. 4T - that is basically the method I use for an endro bike. The problem is, as mentioned above, ........... the chain is set at the most (slack) adjustment that it can have, so it cant be set with more slack. I have a 13t front sprocket, but I dont want to have to resort to that. I have tried increasing the length of the chain with another link + a 2nd split link and it is then too long to get any adjustment. If 1'' is ok, then I am going to have to run with that .... it just seems like not enough play after what I am used to on the enduro bikes. Thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feetupfun Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Making it the same number of links as the one that comes off is a recipe for problems because the previous owner probably took links out as the chain and sprockets wore. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4stroke Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Just make sure that the chain is not tight when the swinging arm is at full extension! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipdamite Posted May 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Making it the same number of links as the one that comes off is a recipe for problems because the previous owner probably took links out as the chain and sprockets wore. You might well have something there. The situation is complicated by the chain adjusters .... I bought some of those majesty adjusters from C.M and they had too large a hole for the spindle, so I had to fit make/some top hats to get this right. On some of the adjustment range, they foul on the shock bottoms due to additional width. So, looks like I need a new chain and some new adjusters. Sorry to be a complete p.i.t.a, but how many links will I need with 12/52 gearing and where is a good place for chain adjusters that fit? I emailed C.M quite a few times with no reply. I cant reuse the old adjusters as they were unserviceable. Thanks for the help so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motovita Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 If you don't want to change sprockets you may need this http://www.trialsbits.co.uk/product_info.php?products_id=1137 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipdamite Posted May 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Hello, I got back from work tonight and went to the bike shed as this issue has been playing on my mind, as something was plainly just not right. I put the bike on the stand and reconnected a link with a 2nd split link, to make the chain longer again and not just copying the length of the old chain ..... still too much slack in the chain, but the adjusters - as mentioned above - were hitting shock and not letting me use the whole cam for adjustment ...... Mrs Shipdamite came out and I bored her with the story ...... she said 'are the adjusters the right way round?' .... I said, 'ummmm, think so', but I drew the spindle and swapped them around .... guess what? full adjustment, and I can get the tension right! So, the adjusters do allow full adjustment - so I take back that comment about the adjusters (spindle hole didnt rectify itself at the same time though ;-] ... ). Moral of the story is - dont just count the links on a knackered chain and cut your new one, and dont assume that you have fitted everything the right way when you first get new bits if they are an integral part to a particular overall set up (if that makes sense) so ..... my last question on this particularly embarrassing (emphasis on ass) episode is .... is it ok to run with 2 split links?? Thanks Motovita ..... looks like a spare worth having. thanks for your inputs Andrew. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4stroke Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 "A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link" not saying a split link is weak but the spring clip can come off and you will have doubled the chances of this! Go for it, no problem. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipdamite Posted May 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 "A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link" not saying a split link is weak but the spring clip can come off and you will have doubled the chances of this! Go for it, no problem. I might try the lockwire pliers on the split link. cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazybond700 Posted May 12, 2015 Report Share Posted May 12, 2015 With the bike supported, remove the rear shocks and raise the back wheel until the swinging arm holds the wheel furthest away from the engine sprocket. Adjust the wheel so that there is a small amount of chain slack. When the wheel is lowered back down and shocks put back on, the tensioner will take up the extra slack. Take note of the gap between rubber pad and swinging arm and set to this distance when wheel adjusted. Thats actually the way to go on any bike if you dont know, and dont have a manual or so. Good topic, since you made basic mistaces, and learned from it! Never believe previous assambly is perfect. Think if everything is right, and try to argue WHY you are right. This makes you learn even more! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipdamite Posted May 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2015 Thats actually the way to go on any bike if you dont know, and dont have a manual or so. Good topic, since you made basic mistaces, and learned from it! Never believe previous assambly is perfect. Think if everything is right, and try to argue WHY you are right. This makes you learn even more! although the manual can be wrong at times. for instance, on the ktm exc enduro bikes, the manual says 5-7mm gap between chain and bottom of swing arm - this is too tight. Similar to 4T's method, you have to remove the shock then get the wheel raised so the centre of the front sprocket, the swing arm spindle and the rear axle are all in line - this is the most the suspension would be ever compressed ......... you then adjust the wheel with a little play in the chain, then refit the shock; this allows almost 3 full links of thechain to be pressed down onto the top of the swingarm! this seems alarmingly loose, but that is where it needs to be. I had run the trials bikes in a similar manner, but had been told that it was too loose and that 'trials bike are different to endure bikes' etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fulltilt Posted May 15, 2015 Report Share Posted May 15, 2015 I believe there are master links available that you can beat the end over with a hammer and then they're as good as any other link. And, what I'm sure you all know already; I always put the clip on the inside and the open end facing back, so it's less likely to pop off it hits a rock or stump. http://www.motosport.com/did-master-link-520erv3-xring 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony27 Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 Hello, I got back from work tonight and went to the bike shed as this issue has been playing on my mind, as something was plainly just not right. I put the bike on the stand and reconnected a link with a 2nd split link, to make the chain longer again and not just copying the length of the old chain ..... still too much slack in the chain, but the adjusters - as mentioned above - were hitting shock and not letting me use the whole cam for adjustment ...... Mrs Shipdamite came out and I bored her with the story ...... she said 'are the adjusters the right way round?' .... I said, 'ummmm, think so', but I drew the spindle and swapped them around .... guess what? full adjustment, and I can get the tension right! So, the adjusters do allow full adjustment - so I take back that comment about the adjusters (spindle hole didnt rectify itself at the same time though ;-] ... ). Moral of the story is - dont just count the links on a knackered chain and cut your new one, and dont assume that you have fitted everything the right way when you first get new bits if they are an integral part to a particular overall set up (if that makes sense) so ..... my last question on this particularly embarrassing (emphasis on ass) episode is .... is it ok to run with 2 split links?? Thanks Motovita ..... looks like a spare worth having. thanks for your inputs Andrew. It is fine to run 2 split links, I think that is what my sherco runs either side of the half link that is needed to get the standard odd number of links in the chain. I always run my split links to the inside, makes finding it a little harder but the tyre protects the clip from getting knocked off 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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