Converting From Classic

[breagh]

Getting way off target now and I have to admit (Even though I'm over 50) old bikes are not my thing.

 

My point is though with that many age/machine/ability related classes throughout the trials scene it's just a nonsense.

 

Personally all trials should be grouped soley by ability lets call it a,b,c,d ride what route you like with whatever bike you like.

 

I know you would get folk riding groups that are too easy for them,but if they're happy for a 8 year old on a Beta 80 or a 70 year old on an Ariel to be riding a harder group than them who am I to judge. 

[charlie prescott]

Hi Guy's.

 

Is it not now really time for the Truth?? that what has finally finished the old adage of Pre 65 Classic trials.

 

Is that it is ,not there fault? and every one needs to earn a living, but it is the few  that have commercially took the bull by the horns so to speak, and fuelled the need by so many, to create  the ultimate Classic Pre 65 trials  bike at any cost  that has finally finished the "Classic trials bike" scene??

 

This has caused the problem with "tighter sections"? that no one in there right mind would bring out a original built before 1965  trials machine out to ride around and enjoy the days so called sport.

 

If we then have a snap decision to bring back a road based trial after being dropped from the menu for a year or two, at the last minute, would we really bother to put the effort in now to get a bike road legal for this event when there is nothing else on the horizon in the near future for anything else?? No.

 

Unless a lot of people pull there finger out ,and start to think how we can rectify this situation, "Classic Trials" for this type of machine in this country  is coming to an end.??

 

You think I am joking?? well I am not.

 

Regards Charlie. 

 

  

Edited June 19, 2015 by charlie prescott

[old trials fanatic]

A lot of good points been made and all of them relevant especially those about the sections severity which are becoming indistinguishable from modern ones. A long time ago in the early 70s you used to be able to tell if you were riding a club trial or open to centre event or national etc purely by the severity of the sections. Now the sections seem no different no matter what level of event you have entered. This not only discourages the riders of more authentic Classic machines but also sadly does nothing to encourage newcomers to the sport. The rise in popularity of the twinshocks is due to a number of things. Firstly the aforementioned sections and their severity but also financial constraints. Very few people nowadays have access to or the skills necessary to machine the parts to build an eligible pre65 bike plus the cost of having them made by a specialist puts a lot of people off the idea so pre65 is becoming the preserve of the few to whom money is no object which is a shame and detrimental to the sport. The only alternative which is not acceptable to the purists and those looking to preserve the current status quo is to allow the use of parts from breakers that cost a fraction of the cost of custom made items but still to a casual observer look the part and conform to the spirit of pre65 thereby allowing people who can wield a spanner but don't have machining facilities to create and maintain a reasonably competitive classic on the sort of budget normal people have to live with for what at the end of the day is only a hobby. Still the same sense of fulfilment to be had building a bike yourself but at a fraction of the cost.

Of course twinshocks are also gaining popularity due to the fact that they appreciate in value and spares are compared to pre65 very readily available at reasonable cost but I feel one of the main drivers in their recent surge is a demographic one. Most of them are around 30 to 40 years old a bit like the riders who remember them from their youth or remember wanting one but being unable to afford one in their youth. They identify with them in a way impossible for a machine built before they were born and that ain't ever going to change.

A lot of clubs no longer get the entries to justify pre unit, unit, 2stroke, 4stroke etc and just lump all entries into pre65 or British bike. At this rate it won't be long before they won't justify a separate class let alone a separate event and will have to be included as twinshocks. Is this a bad thing I don't know. It's a sad thing that I am sure of but I do know that the modern pre65 bike has evolved into something lighter and more competitive than a lot of the twinshocks out there so perhaps they should be included as twinshocks that just happen to be British.

Food for thought.

[bisby]

I won the Spanish twinshocks class in the first year the acu opened up the Sammy Miller trials to twinshocks (2005) I found the sections great and the choice of bike even better especially the big bikes!! I felt like it was an honour to be able to ride with these riders.

I won again in 2008 but the class had been opened up to all makes of twinshock bike and the class was becoming the biggest in the series.

 

I few years later I had a chat with an acu official along the lines of keeping the severity of the sections for the big bikes because if they leave the Sammy Miller series where do they go for there ride?  And his answer was Well that's progress, you cant stop that.  I thought well what a rubbish answer, But he was dead right!

      Stephen. 

[metisse]

Pre 65 bikes have always evolved, and from memory this evolution really took off in the early nineties around the time if memory again is correct, corresponded in the heady entries for classic trials including the Sammy miller rounds. Sadly even at this time there were condescending comments aimed at new builds that did not fit the criteria of what people at the time considered to be correct and more often than not modified Ariels took more flack than others. The S.M trials while very good, catered for the old school unmodified bikes and not for the new breed arriving and low scores meant that sometimes the trial was won or lost on a dab. This discouraged the more competitive rider and bike leaving it to the bikes that enjoyed this format. No problem horses for courses... if you know what I mean. Nowadays all the old boys I know with a beard and a shed at the end of the garden are building light weight bikes, where as twenty years ago they were trying to make a Royal Enfield competitive as well as juggling a job and family. More time, perhaps money and a better equipped shed , means they can have a bike now, that if they it drop, they can a least pickup without wearing truss.

Twinshock remains cheap trialing, for the time being and in my view age related classes are the way to go . The Spanish have it right with the pre 75,pre 78 pre 80 and the rest... bikes are breathed on but remain in the spirit of the classes..

I have no idea how you rein in the current pre 65 scene if in fact it needs it.. My view is those old bikes of yesteryear will remain in the sheds or used purely to get the sunday papers.

[metisse]

Pre 65 bikes have always evolved, and from memory this evolution really took off in the early nineties around the time if memory again is correct, corresponded in the heady entries for classic trials including the Sammy miller rounds. Sadly even at this time there were condescending comments aimed at new builds that did not fit the criteria of what people at the time considered to be correct and more often than not modified Ariels took more flack than others. The S.M trials while very good, catered for the old school unmodified bikes and not for the new breed arriving and low scores meant that sometimes the trial was won or lost on a dab. This discouraged the more competitive rider and bike leaving it to the bikes that enjoyed this format. No problem horses for courses... if you know what I mean. Nowadays all the old boys I know with a beard and a shed at the end of the garden are building light weight bikes, where as twenty years ago they were trying to make a Royal Enfield competitive as well as juggling a job and family. More time, perhaps money and a better equipped shed , means they can have a bike now, that if they it drop, they can a least pickup without wearing truss.

Twinshock remains cheap trialing, for the time being and in my view age related classes are the way to go . The Spanish have it right with the pre 75,pre 78 pre 80 and the rest... bikes are breathed on but remain in the spirit of the classes..

I have no idea how you rein in the current pre 65 scene if in fact it needs it.. My view is those old bikes of yesteryear will remain in the sheds or used purely to get the sunday papers.

[old trials fanatic]

tts pud i never said i didnt like the big bikes. I said i dont like riding them. Like watching them and hearing them. 

[metisse]

There's a word for people who like doing that ......

[roadster]

Well. It looks as though I have made a big mistake. I some success in pre65 sidecar trials in the late70s and eay80s.Iswapped tbe bike for a beamish Suzuki outfit but did not enjoy the harder modern trials. I have had a 30year brek from trials riding but still rode on the road. I was recently offered a

Anotherl pre65 outfit to which I said yes. We have been pra tising but is there going to be any trial left forus to enter.

Sorry a out th typing but I am trhing to use a tou h screen az it is th only xevkce I an use to access this forum.

Rod

[charlie prescott]

[charlie prescott]

Hi Guy’s.

 

Sight!

 

Sound!

 

Movement! (Fast).

 

Atmosphere!

 

My Explanation.

 

Regards Charlie.  PS Ron Langston and son John, Ariel 500 outfit, Colmore Revistment.

[4stroke]

Lets hope the rules and reg's for the ongoing National twinshock championship are robust and detailed enough to stop this happening with Twinshocks!

[charlie prescott]

Hi Guys,

Just copied below, for the "Colmore Revistment Page" on Pre 65,I will click that back up for you too.

 

Do you think that this type of event is the way to get the old bikes back out?

 

Hi Guy's,

What a stunning day out, the Stratford club gave us. A tour around the beautiful Cotswold Countryside passing through lanes that I had not been along since the sixties, but most of them still jogged memories of that time (on one narrow lane I remember Ron Doug, Dan and myself, practising our sidecar racing skills, using all of the lane and sometimes the banks as well, it is only a miracle that we all came out of the lane without injury). The route took us past all the old favourite sections used and even a couple of pubs, and the lunch break gave us a chance to catch up with a few old friends, eventually arriving at Camp, where it seemed as if we were in a time warp. Same old faces of works riders from sixties same old banter and comradeship, same sounds from the bikes, and the strong smell of Castrol "R".
Then the greatest pleasure of walking up one of my all time favourite sections, Camp, with memories from the past flooding back, as we reached our vantage point, the sound of Ron's Ariel crack up, sent shivers down my spine. The anticipation grew as the crescendo of rev's got louder at the bottom of the hill, and the site of the plot coming around the dog leg being ridden at the same old pace and with the same old skill, as the lad had when he was younger was astounding, the determination on his face said it all, as it did with all of the boys that rode up the hill that day, A superb ride from Gordon Jackson on a machine he had only sat on short time before his ride was amazing. Thank you Stars of the past, and thank you to all the hard work the boys of the Stratford club put in.
Wright'y can we have it again next year? All of us old boys would love it, and we won't be here in another 100 years.     

Regards Charlie.

[old trials fanatic]

Lets hope the rules and reg's for the ongoing National twinshock championship are robust and detailed enough to stop this happening with Twinshocks!

Bit late it's already happening.

[laird387]

Bit late it's already happening.

Hi,

 

The regs need a simple first clause:

 

"Any machine entered for this event should be available for sale, in the state in which it is ridden, to any bidder for £1500 in the Finish area of the trial."

 

Then nobody would waste a fortune on trick alloy bits, etc., etc.