Where are all the entries????

[Andy]

Article now on front page with more details and link to map etc. Clickety

[davidbaker]

Interesting thread. As someone who has only done one trial and didn't know what the hell was going for the first hour, I can say the idea of a conducted trial for beginners (regardless of age) is a great idea. I did consider this Seaton Delaval trial to be a bit further away than I would have liked for that particular day due to family commitments, however I will be attending because of the fact it is now conducted and I would like to support the extra effort being put in to try and make a difference for beginners.

Turning up by yourself not knowing what is going on / how things work / what the different flags mean etc can be very off putting - all on top of the stress, I mean fun of trying to get through the sections.

Now that I know there will be someone there to give me some guidance and remove that stress, I can't wait.

Thank you in advance to all concerned.

[baldilocks]

 Brilliant only 3 riders so far but I only posted it last night. Great you are coming @davidbaker

[haysy]

davidbaker  has pointed something out that has never occurred to me before, if you've never even been to a trial before you will have no idea of what the different flags mean. When I started there was only one route so it was fairly obvious where to go.

With this in mind, could we not somehow get first timers to let people know its their first event when signing on and then someone could take them under their wing and ride round with them? Even if its just for the first lap Im sure this would help.

[davidbaker]

Indeed, the only advice given was "follow the white flags" - the fact the white flags turned in to blue and red  flags half way through then back to white for the exit was impossible to figure out until I asked the "this might sound like a stupid question but....". After that I just followed the 6 year old on an electric bike. Not sure but I think I beat him on points - that'll teach him to be 40 years younger than me.

[john b]

Quote

 

Glad it's taking pace ! Great to see it happening

I think people are seeing it's not about teaching people to be better at trials (that's what trials schools are for ) it's about the whole event, what goes on, help with lines etc - making it a good first time experience.

It doesn't need to be every week, to be honest one (or two) events per month will be enough - if we can get a few riders at each one, and if most carry on trailing that's up to 30 new riders??

Unfotunatley I'm at the national Kia round that day but have said to Glen would love to help at the next one , which I hope there will be a next one soon !

Cheers

John

[nigel dabster]

On 06/09/2017 at 5:48 PM, dadof2 said:

Multi lap trials in Northern England (not all by any means but some). The hard course maybe has about 4 or 5 riders as it too difficult for anyone else. Many of the clubman sections are too easy for experienced clubmen. They barely need a glance on the first lap and the other 2 or 3 laps (maybe 1 or 2 miles round) are ridden without even bothering to look at the sections. Add in the inconvenience of some self observing and the cheating that goes with it and the conclusion not to attend that event in future is an easy decision.

I am not going to name specific events or clubs, because even a poorly attended event means hard work for volunteers.

As usual you make a sweeping statement then change it slightly when questioned, if for once you could truthfully say something and stick to it that would help.

And once just for once do something constructive like Quinney has done.

I also take issue with your assesment of riders arguments at the BTC in Low Row, I didnt see any all day and visited every single section. (it was 4 years ago so hardley a relevent example to try and prove your point.)

[dadof2]

ND I have not changed what I said I have merely added a bit more info so even you can possibly understand. I pointed out the BTCC example at low row because I know quite a lot of others witnessed it. You seem to fancy yourself as some sort of layer / post moderator. Why don't you just grow up instead of being a twit.

[trapezeartist]

Girls! Please. This is so unbecoming!

[baldilocks]

On ‎04‎/‎09‎/‎2017 at 5:23 PM, tricky dicky said:

I think that there should definitely be some sort of system in place similar to how it used to be so riders have a rough idea on the severity of the events. This used to be closed to club, restricted to centre, open to centre, national etc etc. Obviously this is unnecessary and can be simplified massively nationwide and not just in each centre as I know this is a problem all around the country.

My suggestions:

Closed to club - straightforward sections with a variety of routes for abilities. Should be pretty easy for the top riders on each course. These are where you would go for your first trial.

Centre Trials - tougher sections on all courses but still with the variety of routes

Centre Championships - basically the same as centre trials but this varies from round to round and is venue dependant.

Nationals - doesn't really need explaining although some nationals do have sections which are too severe at times but this is not every section.

The idea is that the new riders progress upwards if they want to. If the riders don't want a challenge then they can stick to doing closed to club trials and at least they know what they are getting before they go. No point turning up to a centre trial and moaning its too hard if the severity is above them and they know it will be too hard. I think the ACU could get onboard with this too so a system is brought in across the board so it makes it easier to understand for all riders - not just the newbies.

Slightly different but yesterday my club, Sheffield & Hallamshire, ran a charity trial with only one route and 16 sections per lap over a 4.5 mile course. We had 90 entries which was unbelievable to say there were 5 other events on in our centre alone but also shows we must be doing something right.

The sections ranged from usual white route sections (very easy) to expert sections with 3 graded climbs. The idea is that the usual white route riders will struggle on probably half the sections but they only do 2 laps as the inbetween going can be tricky for them. We gave a choice of either 2, 3 or 4 laps and the experts and the majority of the good clubmen (middle course) riders did 4 laps. I think the overall winner doing 4 laps lost around 10 marks doing 4 laps of 16 and he had to ride well but there were no sections at all that an absolute beginner couldn't have a go at. Obviously it won't have suited everybody but it was something completely different to normal and yes a few sections churned up a bit more than expected (especially with 90 riders) but there were no real moans and everybody had a good day out on the bikes. I'm not suggesting this is perfect by any stretch of the imagination but it worked well.

The biggest problem I see is that there is no challenge and no thought in the sections at a lot of trials. Nobody seems to want to lose marks anymore which I find is very odd seen as the event is called a trial. Would you expect to turn up for a round of golf if you are a newbie and go round on par or under par? No you wouldn't so why should it happen at trials! It should be a challenge but shouldn't be dangerous at all. That's my opinion anyway!

The structure set out above used to work very well

However now its potentially  closed to club, centre trials and nationals for modern bikes, then all of those things again for pre 65 / twin shock ?

There is an appetite for small 4 lap courses but equally a lot of people like a single lap trial, yesterdays white rose attracted 130 entries for example.

At some point we need to decide how many national championships we actually need.

At the moment we have

British Championship

British Expert Championship

British A Class Championship

Ladies British Championship

Youth B,C,D Championship

S3 Championship

KIA Championship

British Bike or Pre 65 Championship

there may be more but I'm not sure ?

Then on top of this a national most weekends and various 2 days such as both of the Manx events, Alwinton, Killin, East Yorks, Loch Lomond, Middlesbrough and the Lakes Two Day and then Reeth three day. None of these are bad trials in any way so how do we make them all viable ?

Make the S3 series all two day events ?

Merge KIA and British bike ?

Merge Male and Female Championships ? 

. 

[b40rt]

Think the Kia was born  because the British Bike / Sammy Miller became "unpalatable". 

[nigel dabster]

missed off normandale which has been appalling this year.

[nigel dabster]

On 09/09/2017 at 10:11 PM, dadof2 said:

ND I have not changed what I said I have merely added a bit more info so even you can possibly understand. I pointed out the BTCC example at low row because I know quite a lot of others witnessed it. You seem to fancy yourself as some sort of layer / post moderator. Why don't you just grow up instead of being a twit.

This "added" info completely undermines and qualifies the impression and untruth you gave in the first comment.

You seem hellbent on twisting the truth to suit your argument, and whilst you continue to do this I feel morally obliged to "moderate" your comments, twit or not

[jimmyl]

57 minutes ago, nigel dabster said:

missed off normandale which has been appalling this year.

Entry wise? Organisation or section severity?

 

[jimmyl]

5 hours ago, crashmonkey said:

Potential format for Btc events: All double headers, ladies and girls, youth A and B, adult expert and adult championship - this encompasses lots of the top british riders from the age of 13 upwards, surly this has got to be a good thing.

This could be done with 3 routes flagged and using a 50/50 system between them to provide the correct section severity.

 

 

I think you would struggle to find section that would allow such a varied ability level without compromising either the top level or the lower levels.

How many riders would you have competing at any one time - with all those classes would be up 100 riders  - I think queuing would be an issue over 3 laps.

Good youth A can compete in full BTC as can good females.

Double headers are good for travel but means club officials have to commit to 2 days observing etc.

Maybe have 2 rounds close by - to reduce travel cost .