Where are all the entries????

[on it]

1 hour ago, nigel dabster said:

people die. we need new riders.

 

1 hour ago, nigel dabster said:

people die. we need new riders.

WOW great  state the obvious !!!!!   .Clubs have tried  multi course ,multi classes, free entry to kids, training  so were are they & how many trials riders that go to trials are NOT riding this weekend ,    some  sports just die out

[lopez]

1 hour ago, on it said:

 

WOW great  state the obvious !!!!!   .Clubs have tried  multi course ,multi classes, free entry to kids, training  so were are they & how many trials riders that go to trials are NOT riding this weekend ,    some  sports just die out

But they don't have to die out.

There has already been a lot of discussion in this thread about some of the reasons that new riders don't enter trials.......

The common themes seem to be

1) Accessibility/ease of use from an administrative perspective - ie joining, knowing when events are on, knowing where to go, facilities, advertising
2) Once you find an event, general bewilderment/finding the sport confusing or difficult to break into as a novice
3) Actual section difficulty.

Multi course addresses 3) although it can actually inadvertently add to the issues caused by 2), but I don't think things like bike training and free entry and multiple classes/routes actually make the sport easier to get involved in. 

Edited September 22, 2017 by lopez

[b40rt]

13 minutes ago, lopez said:

But they don't have to die out.

There has already been a lot of discussion in this thread about some of the reasons that new riders don't enter trials.......

The common themes seem to be

1) Accessibility/ease of use from an administrative perspective - ie joining, knowing when events are on, knowing where to go, facilities, advertising
2) Once you find an event, general bewilderment/finding the sport confusing or difficult to break into as a novice
3) Actual section difficulty.

Multi course addresses 3) although it can actually inadvertently add to the issues caused by 2), but I don't think things like bike training and free entry and multiple classes/routes actually make the sport easier to get involved in. 

Trials have never been easier to get involve in. Fact.

20/30 years ago there was no internet to speak of, no advertising, post entries only, one route. 

No sat nav either so finding venues could be challenging. 

State of the art bikes weighted 95kg minimum, riding gear was crap by todays standards.

None of the above stopped big entries or new riders getting involved - why is it so difficult now ?

[2stroke4stroke]

b40rt is right, certainly for trials in Scotland.  Re point 2, someone upthread mentioned this though I can't help but think if they had looked at the ACU rules, and they signed to say they had, then their bewilderment might have been substantially lessened.  As with any competitive sport, at least have a look at the basics of the rules beforehand.  In my experience an obvious beginner is always taken in hand by somebody, such is the friendly nature of the sport.

If you don't want to be "competitive" then fine but don't be unhappy when you find out that it is a competition that people wish to be taken reasonably seriously and indeed (another point raised earlier) where riders have been happily negotiating the same between section going for many decades without issue or injury.  On which point, I have travelled to ride in the northern part of the NE Centre for near fifty years and the easy route comprises the same sections, or easier, as were in use those decades ago by the heavy bikes, on 4 ply tyres, that b40rt mentions.  That being the case I don't feel they represent an undue hazard to a beginner on a modern bike.

Part of the modern approach to things I suppose, and you might be surprised how many riders don't seem to have much knowledge of the correct scoring methodology/definition of section boundaries, judging by lines one sees used and the resulting scores at some observe yourself events.

Edited September 22, 2017 by 2stroke4stroke

[lopez]

I'm only hypothesising, I haven't been involved in the sport for 50 years so I don't know myself - I'm just looking at the feedback within the thread

[2stroke4stroke]

And I am trying to put the feedback in to perspective for those fortunate enough not to be old farts.

[cleanorbust]

One issue which may have contributed to reduced entries at some trials has been highlighted in chatting to one or two long-standing riders. For years they and their mates have got by at trials using the public road by dint of a fake registration number and a scribble on the entry form to accept responsibility for being road legal when they're not. The unexpected attendance of the police during some recent events has caused them to think again and they sit out road trials, at least for the moment, to ensure they still have a licence to drive to private land trials during the rest of the year.

I make no judgement of them, but their absence affects entries to some extent.

Edited September 23, 2017 by cleanorbust

[turbofurball]

On 22/9/2017 at 0:31 PM, b40rt said:

None of the above stopped big entries or new riders getting involved - why is it so difficult now ?

Because now, for much less money than a trials bike, you can get a nice full suspension mountain bike which doesn't need mucking about with premix or cleaning air filters every week, can be ridden anywhere, doesn't annoy people with noise, etc etc. ... and for most people it scratches the same itch.

Possibly.

[cleanorbust]

In my experience of attending and riding trials in several centres in the UK over five decades, the sport in general has never really concerned itself with trying to attract new riders in, and it isn't a worry for the organisers I know any more than it was years ago, in fact it never comes up in conversation. For many years, I've heard people say we have to market the sport.  By and large, we haven't done so. But here we are, the sport hasn't died or, as far as the events I attend are an example, even been injured so that anyone has noticed. Sure, the nature of trials has changed but I'm not aware of a feeling of impending doom. The average age of riders may be older than when I started, though I'm not sure about that and if it is true it's not a new phenomenon.

Perhaps collapse lurks just around the corner.

Edited September 23, 2017 by cleanorbust

[b40rt]

3 hours ago, turbofurball said:

Because now, for much less money than a trials bike, you can get a nice full suspension mountain bike which doesn't need mucking about with premix or cleaning air filters every week, can be ridden anywhere, doesn't annoy people with noise, etc etc. ... and for most people it scratches the same itch.

Possibly.

 

Fair point, I have a full sus mb, still prefer trials. Much less money ???

 

https://www.stif.co.uk/bikebuilder/santa-cruz-v10-cc-complete-bike/112?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIopLurM681gIV3MqyCh3jjQt5EAQYAiABEgLL0_D_BwE

 

[trapezeartist]

15 hours ago, cleanorbust said:

One issue which may have contributed to reduced entries at some trials has been highlighted in chatting to one or two long-standing riders. For years they and their mates have got by at trials using the public road by dint of a fake registration number and a scribble on the entry form to accept responsibility for being road legal when they're not. The unexpected attendance of the police during some recent events has caused them to think again and they sit out road trials, at least for the moment, to ensure they still have a licence to drive to private land trials during the rest of the year.

I make no judgement of them, but their absence affects entries to some extent.

I'm afraid I do have to make a judgement. Riding illegal bikes on the road without tax, MOT or insurance is, well, illegal. It won't just bite the riders on the backside: it could knock on to the whole sport. It's "bringing the sport into disrepute".

12 hours ago, cleanorbust said:

In my experience of attending and riding trials in several centres in the UK over five decades, the sport in general has never really concerned itself with trying to attract new riders in, and it isn't a worry for the organisers I know any more than it was years ago, in fact it never comes up in conversation. For many years, I've heard people say we have to market the sport.  By and large, we haven't done so. But here we are, the sport hasn't died or, as far as the events I attend are an example, even been injured so that anyone has noticed. Sure, the nature of trials has changed but I'm not aware of a feeling of impending doom. The average age of riders may be older than when I started, though I'm not sure about that and if it is true it's not a new phenomenon.

A note of common sense. Thank you. Nevertheless I still think it would help if there was some "marketing" of the sport. Kick Start and the televising of World Championship and Indoor trials did (does) that to some extent but it perhaps puts off as many people as it encourages. Some people will look at the sections and think that it is far too dangerous and way beyond their potential capabilities (probably rightly). Then they won't look any further and see what fun can be had wobbling up and down banks and around trees.

[turbofurball]

20 hours ago, oni nou said:

Mind you it has got Maxxis tyres on it, they account for about £30.00 of the robbery... You need to keep that price quiet or Trials bike manufacturers will start charging £15.599.00 for a top of the ranger ..............

I got my Scott suspension bike for £100, and spent about £150 making it mechanically sound.  It's not light, but otherwise nice :-)

That's about the same as I've spent on my Gasgas in the last year after buying it, not including petrol, 2-stroke oil, filter oil, or engine oil (and I need to do the fork seals now ...)

[b40rt]

4 hours ago, turbofurball said:

I got my Scott suspension bike for £100, and spent about £150 making it mechanically sound.  It's not light, but otherwise nice :-)

 

If you were competing in cross country / downhill / time trials, I suspect the costs would be similar to trials. 

[turbofurball]

Dunno about that, you can be conpetitive on cross country on a £2K bike ... anyway, this is getting away from my main point, which is that modern mountain bikes are super convenient, multi-purpose, low on faff, and can be ridden anywhere.  The cost is a more minor consideration.

Another thing is that riding a trials bike is less environmentally friendly, which matters to many young people.

[2stroke4stroke]

4 hours ago, b40rt said:

If you were competing in cross country / downhill / time trials, I suspect the costs would be similar to trials. 

Actually Ross, you're not right there.  The average trials rider would faint at the level of entry fee for even a low level mountain bike event.  I suppose all that piped music and other extraneous nonsense has to be paid for somehow.