British Champ - F.i.m Rules 06

[scorpa3]

Regardless of rules!! I think the C of C can mark a trial in a way that it is no benefit to pratt about hopping, those that do set a trial in this way will soon see if attendance goes up or down, and those that mark a trial tight step turn step tight hop hop hop dab dab hop dab pheeeeeeep whistle went, it's ok he was within 30 ft of the end cards we'll give him the benefit of doubt will see likewise.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

In theory you are totally correct. The only trouble with this approach is, that setting out a trial so that hopping etc is not required to ride the sections, means that those who are able to do it well have an even bigger advantage.

What's the point of having an event where the wobblers can wobble around without hopping and the top 10 Experts are all on 0?

I really dislike the FIM rules and despair at the thought of having three sets of rules to run to. Just to benefit the tope few International riders who would still be the top riders under any rules.

[outlaw dave]

Scorpa - The best riders will win no matter what rules are used I think the point of this thread is to make sure the rest of the entry go home with a smile. -

[scorpa3]

Scorpa - The best riders will win no matter what rules are used I think the point of this thread is to make sure the rest of the entry go home with a smile. -

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yep... Thats what I said.

[timp]

How long till some clubs start running club trials under the British Champ rules. Not long I think.

This rule may work for British champs but for any other trial it will be like going back to the 90s. A total farce.

This a backwards step in the UK.

The last few years has gone very well with the 2 sets of rules we have now. I hardly hear any moans about observing nowadays. Most people I know are happy as things are. Its not perfect but it works.

These are not just clubmen but some of the best riders in the country. I think if a proper effort was made to ask riders what rules they prefer we would be staying as we are now.

Mark T

ps. Lets hope the FIM change the rules soon so we can have 4 sets of rules at once

Edited December 18, 2005 by Timp

[john collins]

Without going into too much debate at present time - as I am up to my eyes in a few other things - let me just state a few facts that others seem to be just assuming.

The F.I.M rules will only apply to the 7 British Champ rounds in 2006

There is no option for others to follow - they will run - as per Standing Trials Regs - ie TSR 22 0r No - Stop that is ALL trials except Brit Adult Solo.

At end of 2006 - or near it - it is the present intention to take the opinion of all the riders who rode in it, all the Observers (Clubs) who observed it and all the organisers who did the actual work.

If it has not worked, or if it has been like watching paint dry etc

There will be no pedantic dogma - the whole thing will have to be reviewed

It is certainly an experiment.

[woody]

As John has mentioned again, FIM rules should only apply to the full British Champs. so why should Joe clubman give a hoot or worry about what they do with that series - it doesn't affect the vast majority. Club, centre and National events should carry on as they are now.

With regard to previous posts about marking out trials to negate any advantage trick riding gives, it can't be done 100%. No matter how the section is laid out if someone can dance the bike about it will, more often than not, give them an advantage over 'Mr conventional' as it offers a wider variety and choice of lines. Illustrated today in our trial where a no stop ride over the problem part of a section was very difficult to achieve, but nevertheless still possible and it was done on a few occasions. Riders that could trick simply stopped jinked the front and back about and then hopped over the obstacle face on instead of at 45 degrees. Big advantage. Easy clean. Even in the SSDT riders perform blatant stops whilst flicking the front or back wheels which gives them a significant advantage with better lines than a rider using a genuine no-stop attempt.

As far as FIM rules in BC is concerned it makes no difference to me at all, so I don't really care what they do with it. But if people seriously think that going back to full on trick riding and the harder sections that style dictates will benefit trials, take a look at the results of two of today's trials. Only 4 riders below 100 marks in the Southern Experts with Ross Danby on 95.... and he can ride a bit. The rest must have really enjoyed their days trialing. I wasn't there however, so there may be exceptional circumstances for the scores. And then there is the YMSA trial, a club that always puts on tight sections and today saw half the entry retired, 3 finish under 100 marks and the rest on cricket scores. The intermediate winner was on 134 and they ride eased versions of the expert route... In fact, the last 3 events I believe, has seen the Intermediate winner lose more than 100.

The way forward...?? As I said, makes no difference to me, just an observation.

[timp]

How long till some clubs start running club trials under the British Champ rules. Not long I think.

I didn't say they would apply for a permit. What I meant is they would run their trials as per the British Champ Rules as apparently a lot do now (so they say in previous posts). I know they won't get a permit.

[scorpa3]

How long till some clubs start running club trials under the British Champ rules. Not long I think.

I didn't say they would apply for a permit. What I meant is they would run their trials as per the British Champ Rules as apparently a lot do now (so they say in previous posts). I know they won't get a permit.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Surely the observing rules can be specified, quiet legitimately, in the final regulations, long after the permit has been issued by the ACU?

[john collins]

No they cannot.

The ACU rules ( except British Champ for 06) are TSR 22A or Non Stop.

Clubs ( with the exception of Boxing Day Trials Bradford - who had specific permission last year - and again this year - when hopefully a few facts eg time can be assessed ) - must run under these rules.

All ACU events run under the Standing Trials Regs - and at the top of the regs for each event it will state" Run under the N.S.C and Standing Trials Reghs of ACU etc, these supplementary Regs and any Final Instructions issued.

Supplementary Regs - ie Regs particular to an event - cannot conflict with the Standing Trials Regs - neither can Final Instructions.

The Permit is issued clearly on this basis.

So any Club using their own version of the rules ( not No-Stop or TSR 22 - will be in contravention of the SR's and therefore the Permit.

Where a Club put something in the Sup Regs - that is not in conflict with the Standing Regs - ( and obviously does not bring Sport into disrepute or is obviously dangerous etc) it is very much up to the Club.

So - If a Club decide on a particular day everyone must wear a Red helmet - this is up to them - there is no conflict with Standing Regs !

If however they decide to run under FIM rules - there is

[the artist formerly known as ish]

At end of 2006 - or near it - it is the present intention to take the opinion of all the riders who rode in it, all the Observers (Clubs)  who observed it and all the organisers who did the actual work.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

None of my business really, but isn't the above asking the minority of riders what they think is best for the majority ?

Shouldn't the governing body, if so concerned about getting it correct, send every trials rider with a registration card a return postage paid post card asking a simple question, tick the box of the rules you would most like to ride under.