Jap zap help (video)

[Sheepy]

2 hours ago, al_orange said:

Sheepy - out of interest can you jump clean on top of it by using the double blip? I know you're trying to learn the zap but if you get the double blip first then you can add in the clutch. That way you can separate the jump and the clutch aspects and nail both. 

I haven’t filmed myself doing a double blipso I’m not sure how much lift im getting,but I can clear it without the bash plate hitting most of the time. Good point though,I should keep practicing double blip until I can start adding the clutch.

thanks 

like others have said I left the clutch alone after the initial drop today and started feeling like I was making progress

[Sheepy]

15 hours ago, jonnyc21 said:

Sheepy,

something Jacob429 said reminded me that just like the jump on top without a bike your doing the same thing with the bike.  When that clicked in my head I got it first attempt.  It feels like your going to ram your hips into the bars, however what happens is that the bike moves forward as you do so you and the bike land on top with issue.  Before that I was just jumping up, and thinking my forward movement was enough to carry me op and over.

One of the hard parts of doing this on the round tire is that it's more difficult to punch the front tire into rather than set it on top or glance it off of the round portion of the tire.  You will have better luck with a bit more revs and be faster with the clutch but that has other risks.  

Good luck.

So I should be jumping as if I’m just jumping without the bike up onto the tyres? Should I pull on the bars too or let the momentum do it?

thanks 

[jacob429]

1 hour ago, Sheepy said:

So I should be jumping as if I’m just jumping without the bike up onto the tyres? Should I pull on the bars too or let the momentum do it?

thanks 

You don't have to pull on the bars, you can though. What you want to avoid is pushing against the bars, let them come to you. Part of the lift comes from the rotation of the chassis, so pushing away from the bars will prevent that rotation thus reducing lift. 

In your video you were punching it fine and getting enough compression from the suspension so you're good there. Your body was just a bit farther back than needed or you weren't jumping forward enough. You're so close to getting it, you'll have some "ah-ha!" moments soon if you keep practicing. That obstacle is good practice and the consequences for messing up should be minimal, so next time you do it you just gotta know you got it no problem and go for it!

[Sheepy]

2 minutes ago, jacob429 said:

You don't have to pull on the bars, you can though. What you want to avoid is pushing against the bars, let them come to you. Part of the lift comes from the rotation of the chassis, so pushing away from the bars will prevent that rotation thus reducing lift. 

In your video you were punching it fine and getting enough compression from the suspension so you're good there. Your body was just a bit farther back than needed or you weren't jumping forward enough. You're so close to getting it, you'll have some "ah-ha!" moments soon if you keep practicing. That obstacle is good practice and the consequences for messing up should be minimal, so next time you do it you just gotta know you got it no problem and go for it!

Thinking back,I’m not jumping farward at all,just up! Also,I haven’t touched my suspension since I’ve had the bike,I don’t want to start blaming the bike at all because an experienced rider could do whatever he wanted with it. But maybe setting it for my weight could give me a helping hand! 

 

[jonnyc21]

3 hours ago, Sheepy said:

So I should be jumping as if I’m just jumping without the bike up onto the tyres? Should I pull on the bars too or let the momentum do it?

thanks 

If you use more body and pull on the bars you will get more lift for larger and more undercut obstacles, for your sized tire you should be able to just jump forward, and as indicated, just not push on the bars but let them come to you.  

You can also add a small pull up on the bars as a way to help with timing and preparation for larger obstacles.

Edited February 3, 2018 by jonnyc21

[scifi]

I think you have the 'Getting onto the Tyres' bit nailed, but you are stopping at the top.   I also ride Classic motorbikes and my Classic Club uses the 'non-stopping' rules...  So that would be an instant 5 for you.  Even in Stopping Allowed rules you would get either a 1, or a 3 if you put both feet on the floor.

So maybe try it the other way around, or use a plank onto the tyres, so that you concentrate on getting off the tyres with the front wheel under control.  In some of the National trials, sections such as 'Pipeline' will see these rocks coming at you thick and fast, so you really need to keep the front wheel under control, so it does not dive into the bottom of the next rock.   You need your front wheel to meet the top of each rock, big or small, so that it causes the least amount of resistance to forward motion.

To practice Wheelies, I have a Willow tree in my back garden, and it has fronds dangling from it.  I choose a frond that is 5 foot from the ground, and practice hitting it with my front wheel... straight up, then straight down again... the bike hardly moves forwards.   You could try dangling a Tennis Ball from a string, if you haven't got a Willow Tree..

Best of Luck, please join a club and enter some easy trials ..sooooon.....

try...     https://www.acu.org.uk/Centres-Clubs/

.

Edited February 3, 2018 by scifi
ACU Clubs Link.

[lineaway]

 Ryan Young has made two excellent videos that he sells.

 

[bikerpet]

I'm definitely no expert at this, a bit of a beginner indeed. However as I've been working on the same skills a few things have helped me, maybe they'll help others.

1. This video  talks of a "touch up". Probably what might be called a double blip more than a zap, but I consider that if I use clutch it's a zap (rightly or wrongly, I don't care - works for me). I found that rather than dropping the front wheel into the obstacle it was easier to get the timing together if I hit the obstacle on the rise. Interestingly after watching this then watching Trials GP this actually looks more like what the pro's do most of the time rather than dropping the wheel onto the obstacle.

2. I spent a bit of time doing stationary zaps on a tiny obstacle - maybe 150 - 200mm  (6-8") high. Gave me the confidence to really drop the clutch and have a few revs, and also get the movement and timing dialled in a bit better without any significant consequences. I had a tiny rocky step, a large curb would be similar.

3. As the Ryan Young/Pat Smage zap video above says, I find it easier to ride into it with the clutch slipping, then drop the clutch for the zap. Heaps easier for bumbly's like me to get the timing compared to clutch out/in/out.

4. As also mentioned above, closing the throttle when dropping the clutch makes a big difference to the pop/lift. It does however rely on having enough revs up to carry the bike up to the top. Point 2. gave me the confidence to actually bring the revs up a bit closer to what's needed. Still a bit scared of too many revs, but getting better bit by bit.

EDIT: Out of interest I took sample out of the Young/Smage Zap video and tracked the front axle path to check that what I think happens actually does happen. And yes, the front wheel hits the object whilst on the rise.

 

Edited August 21, 2018 by bikerpet