16 vs. 18

[RainyDaze]

Looking at my first trials bike and I’m going electric so I can ride on my own property. My local dealer has a new ‘16 sport for $1500 off MSRP. I’m torn if I should scoop that up or get an ‘18. Are the motor improvements that significant or any other refinements that would make a new ‘18 a better option?

[section swept]

With such a large discount off an obviously old model I would be investigating such things as battery performance and charge times. Heavily discounted machines mean less perseived residual value when you want to sell or part exchange. You state $1500 off MSRP but what was the selling price from other dealers. 

[trapezeartist]

Without any specific knowledge of the EMs, I would be wary too. Electric bikes are new technology and therefore it's reasonable to expect significant changes and improvements over two years. It's not like run-of-the-mill 2Ts where only the stickers change.

[RainyDaze]

14 hours ago, section swept said:

With such a large discount off an obviously old model I would be investigating such things as battery performance and charge times. Heavily discounted machines mean less perseived residual value when you want to sell or part exchange. You state $1500 off MSRP but what was the selling price from other dealers. 

There is only one dealer in my state. They'd have to order a 2018 at MSRP, $9,595. The '16 is sitting on the showroom floor, and in my opinion $1500 off is a fair deal for a leftover model of any bike, provided it doesn't have some glaring performance or reliability issues. 

So few folks have these bikes it's hard to find an opinion (or facts) on how different each model year has been.

Someone mentioned in another post on this forum that he's ridden a '15, '16, and '17 and the '17 was the best yet. Was it $1500 better??  That's what I'd like to know.

Considering this dealer has a '16 on the floor and it isn't selling after 2 years, I'm worried that when it comes time for me to sell it I'll have a hard time finding buyer. I might lose less reselling the '16 with the discount though. 

 

Edited May 3, 2018 by RainyDaze

[collyolly]

I would check out the turning circle of both bikes as I tried an early bike (not sure of the year) and the steering lock was awful only way to get round tight stuff was to trick ride which is good if you can do it but a whole technique to learn if you have just come off a GasGas or Beta.

What previous trials experiance have you got as the E.M.  is just so different to ride from a 'clutch'  bike.

Lastly, secondhand value,  as you say it's been stuck in the dealers so don't buy it expecting to get much of your money back especially if your not living in an area where trials is popular.

[trapezeartist]

7 hours ago, RainyDaze said:

Considering this dealer has a '16 on the floor and it isn't selling after 2 years, I'm worried that when it comes time for me to sell it I'll have a hard time finding buyer.

I think you've answered your own question there, Rainy.

[canada280i]

Hit the dealer up for a bigger discount. I would be putting all these points to him, it is only depreciating more the longer it sits in his showroom. The worst he can say is no, and that is the time to walk away.

[RainyDaze]

7 hours ago, collyolly said:

I would check out the turning circle of both bikes as I tried an early bike (not sure of the year) and the steering lock was awful only way to get round tight stuff was to trick ride which is good if you can do it but a whole technique to learn if you have just come off a GasGas or Beta.

What previous trials experiance have you got as the E.M.  is just so different to ride from a 'clutch'  bike.

Lastly, secondhand value,  as you say it's been stuck in the dealers so don't buy it expecting to get much of your money back especially if your not living in an area where trials is popular.

I have zero riding experience with Trials, but have owned motorcycles for +30 years. I ride a '16 KTM300xc-w now and want to explore something new that will also benefit my woods riding skills. A silent electric bike would be the ticket since I could ride in my yard and some other local areas that wouldn't draw any attention. Where I live we drive 1-2 hours to get to a riding area.

I recently put a Rekluse and LHRB (left hand rear brake) on my KTM and I really like it. It operates like my mountain bike now. The EM without a clutch would be setup similarly and would be a great training tool. If the trials bug bit me hard I could always join a local club and get a proper gasser later. 

I have read others mention the turning radius. I'll have to go see it in person again to see if that'll be a deal breaker for me. 

I've also heard there could be updates for 2019 with the EM ePure, but what those are is still a mystery. That will likely affect the resale value even more. If future electric bikes come out with gears and clutches and are in the price range of the new GasGas TXE ($15k USD) then this discounted '16 may not depreciate bad as you may initially think. It may not be as versatile, but it'd be half the cost.

Too bad the E bikes haven't really taken off yet. I'm probably a couple years early.

[RainyDaze]

5 hours ago, canada280i said:

Hit the dealer up for a bigger discount. I would be putting all these points to him, it is only depreciating more the longer it sits in his showroom. The worst he can say is no, and that is the time to walk away.

I wonder what the dealer cost is on these things? From what I've heard over the years, the dealers don't make much on bike sales. The parts and service is where the money is. 

Making him a lower offer is definitely the right move if I decide to try out the EM.

[section swept]

17 hours ago, RainyDaze said:

There is only one dealer in my state. They'd have to order a 2018 at MSRP, $9,595. The '16 is sitting on the showroom floor, and in my opinion $1500 off is a fair deal for a leftover model of any bike, provided it doesn't have some glaring performance or reliability issues. 

So few folks have these bikes it's hard to find an opinion (or facts) on how different each model year has been.

Someone mentioned in another post on this forum that he's ridden a '15, '16, and '17 and the '17 was the best yet. Was it $1500 better??  That's what I'd like to know.

Considering this dealer has a '16 on the floor and it isn't selling after 2 years, I'm worried that when it comes time for me to sell it I'll have a hard time finding buyer. I might lose less reselling the '16 with the discount though. 

 

You said it!

[canada280i]

How much is it actually up for at the moment ( not the Msrp), $1500 off the msrp for a 2 year old bike is not a good deal. I would not go in any more than $7000, and would likely start lower than that and see what I can get away with, it’s all about haggling!

[RainyDaze]

1 hour ago, canada280i said:

How much is it actually up for at the moment ( not the Msrp), $1500 off the msrp for a 2 year old bike is not a good deal. I would not go in any more than $7000, and would likely start lower than that and see what I can get away with, it’s all about haggling!

The dealer said $7900 USD. It has zero miles and a full warranty still. 

Another guy in here sold a used ‘17 for $6500, so yes $7900 is a bit to high.

[collyolly]

I just checked out your ReKluse auto clutch, I can understand the appeal for trail riding but I cannot see the connection to Trials, once you understand the machine control required for the technical side of Trials riding you will see that an auto clutch is never going to work, people fuss over a bite point of a clutch moving by a millimetre at the handlebars.

There was a time when everyone rode without touching the clutch, sections were more free flowing, nowadays most sections above beginner level will require a rider to have complete control on a turn prior to a climb or descent and the use of the clutch is the key to this.

This bike you are considering is an expensive experiment enabling you to play in your own back yard but what else will it do for you ?

But if you have the money and an itch to scratch, then scratch it ! ( Just be prepared to loose a fair chunk of cash )

[oldtrialer]

Or you could go the cheaper route and get an Oset 24 if you are not too big. I've had mine for a year now, and it is the perfect play bike. After 40 years on gas trials bikes, it was easy to go back to the 70's riding style on the Oset. With the wider rear wheel and the spare battery I just got, I'm still only in for about $5500.

[RainyDaze]

6 hours ago, collyolly said:

I just checked out your ReKluse auto clutch, I can understand the appeal for trail riding but I cannot see the connection to Trials, once you understand the machine control required for the technical side of Trials riding you will see that an auto clutch is never going to work, people fuss over a bite point of a clutch moving by a millimetre at the handlebars.

There was a time when everyone rode without touching the clutch, sections were more free flowing, nowadays most sections above beginner level will require a rider to have complete control on a turn prior to a climb or descent and the use of the clutch is the key to this.

This bike you are considering is an expensive experiment enabling you to play in your own back yard but what else will it do for you ?

But if you have the money and an itch to scratch, then scratch it ! ( Just be prepared to loose a fair chunk of cash )

Yes, the auto clutch is a tool for trails and a huge energy saver for long rides. It’s a total cheater tool, and works super well for its purpose, which isn’t trials. 

That being said, I’ve seen some very impressive trials riding on these EM bikes, at a level that would take me years to achieve, if at all. 

The cost of this experiment is what I’m agonizing over. I have 7 acres of land so there is lots of fun that could be had here. Feels like I’m a year too early too. There seems to be a lot of advancement in electric trials and 2019 may see some new releases and significant improvements (clutches and gears)