PB1980 Posted October 2, 2018 Report Share Posted October 2, 2018 Hi am I right in thinking that I shouldn’t get a shock from touching my HT lead while my bike is running ? Could this maybe be why it’s a pig to start sometimes ? It’s a 2008 txt pro 280 thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted October 3, 2018 Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 Who needs Comedy Central when you got stuff like this on Trials Central? Yes you can get a shock. Don’t touch it and DON’T pull the wire off the plug when it’s running. Trust me on this. When it’s not running check the lead for cracks in the insulation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d2w Posted October 3, 2018 Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 (edited) Just where are you touching the HT lead? If you're touching an insulated section then no problem. If you're touching the exposed conductor and you're also touching the return path to the HT circuit then you should experience a helluva jolt. But what you're experiencing is likely the pickiness of the GG starting ritual. Search this forum as we've all experienced your current frustration. The quick fix/suggestion is to: Put the bike into 2nd gear. Clutch out. Roll backwards until the compression stops you. Clutch in. Apply light pressure to the kick starter until it just stops. Then kick hard. If the choke is engaged then don't touch the throttle until it's sparked. If it's already warm you may need to twist the throttle while kicking. If you attempt to fan the kick starter repeatedly like an enduro you're going to experience a heap of hurt in your wallet as you damage the starter gear mechanism. Also ensure that you're jetting is correct. Good gas. Clean carb. Fresh plug. The usual suspects. I can spark my GG in one kick when warm. Two maximum if cold. Edited October 3, 2018 by d2w 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feetupfun Posted October 3, 2018 Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 There is always leakage from high voltage systems. Have a listen to the insulators at a HV transmission cable tower. That crackling and hissing noise is air being ionised (like lightning but on a smaller scale). These get washed with demineralised water to minimise the losses. You can minimise the power losses from your bike's ignition by keeping the HT coil, lead and cap clean and free of any conductive residue. Also check that your plug gap is not too wide and that the conductors inside the cap are in good condition. If you see carbon anywhere in there, it means there has been sparking happening which will reduce the voltage across the plug gap. The HV circuit on a motorbike runs at something like 50,000 volts so even the tiniest bit of leakage can flow through your salty body with great ease and cause damage and discomfort, so don't touch it with the motor running. Some ignitions need the flywheel to rotate at a higher minimum RPM than others to make a decent spark. This means that starting technique can be important. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PB1980 Posted October 3, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 Thanks for the tips guys and dan Williams get a life mate if that’s the funniest thing you’ve read in a while . Thought helping people out was what this forum was for must be great to be you and know everything ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcman56 Posted October 3, 2018 Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 Comedy Central - I was once riding a V twin motorcycle with no insulation at the spark plug cap while wearing shorts. I lost my balance at a stop, planted my foot on the ground and the bike laid against my leg. Continuous high voltage shocks zapped my leg while I fought to regain balance and get the bike off of my leg. So, I can say from experience you would know. (This was prior to Youtube.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PB1980 Posted October 3, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 So it’s not just novices like me then who like to hurt ourselves?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section swept Posted October 3, 2018 Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 2 hours ago, feetupfun said: There is always leakage from high voltage systems. Have a listen to the insulators at a HV transmission cable tower. That crackling and hissing noise is air being ionised (like lightning but on a smaller scale). These get washed with demineralised water to minimise the losses. You can minimise the power losses from your bike's ignition by keeping the HT coil, lead and cap clean and free of any conductive residue. Also check that your plug gap is not too wide and that the conductors inside the cap are in good condition. If you see carbon anywhere in there, it means there has been sparking happening which will reduce the voltage across the plug gap. The HV circuit on a motorbike runs at something like 50,000 volts so even the tiniest bit of leakage can flow through your salty body with great ease and cause damage and discomfort, so don't touch it with the motor running. Some ignitions need the flywheel to rotate at a higher minimum RPM than others to make a decent spark. This means that starting technique can be important. The bodies reaction to electric shock is a muscle spasm that can take a long time to settle down...luckily that 50,000 volts is only about 0.5 of an amp so it shouldn’t kill you unless you are unlucky enough to suffer epilepsy. When you bang your funny bone that pain multiplied by 100+ equals the sort of pain. Some people can touch the HT leads without any shock but they tend to have very dry skin usually calussed as well. If you have soft skin or clammy skin look ? out⚡️I’ve seen a moto x rider flung to the other side of the track when he decided to pull the HT lead off his revving out bike...the muscle spasm must have really hurt he was stretchered off the track. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted October 3, 2018 Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 4 hours ago, PB1980 said: Thanks for the tips guys and dan Williams get a life mate if that’s the funniest thing you’ve read in a while . Thought helping people out was what this forum was for must be great to be you and know everything ! It is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted October 3, 2018 Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 1 hour ago, section swept said: luckily that 50,000 volts is only about 0.5 of an amp so it shouldn’t kill you Depends on where it goes. 500mA is more than enough to disturb the sinus rhythm and throw you into ventricular fibrillation. When I learned not to pull the wire of a running bike I could feel my heart stop. Not particularly pleasant. Funny thing though was many years later my nephew showed me a paper he’d written for school describing when he did the same thing on one of my bikes he borrowed. The current was sufficient to burn through his leather glove and the pad on the knee of his riding pants. He also said the friend he was riding with said it was the loudest scream he’d ever heard. My nephew said he doesn’t remember screaming and couldn’t hear it because of the loud buzzing in his head. And yeah, after the fact both were pretty funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section swept Posted October 3, 2018 Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 (edited) 54 minutes ago, dan williams said: Depends on where it goes. 500mA is more than enough to disturb the sinus rhythm and throw you into ventricular fibrillation. When I learned not to pull the wire of a running bike I could feel my heart stop. Not particularly pleasant. Funny thing though was many years later my nephew showed me a paper he’d written for school describing when he did the same thing on one of my bikes he borrowed. The current was sufficient to burn through his leather glove and the pad on the knee of his riding pants. He also said the friend he was riding with said it was the loudest scream he’d ever heard. My nephew said he doesn’t remember screaming and couldn’t hear it because of the loud buzzing in his head. And yeah, after the fact both were pretty funny. The higher amperage in the case of electric shock will cook the muscles and anything else it passes through. It’s bloody nasty being electrocuted, entry point just hides the damage going on inside, the exit point will be awful and it usually involves a surgeon having to cut away dead and dying body tissue and that which has been electrically cooked. It isn’t funny and it certainly needs to be avoided, goodness knows what those poor *******s who were sent to the electric chair thought ....scarred sh**less I would imagine. Electric shock affects the brain first by sending it into an electrical storm, that produces the heart stopping symptom and if not corrected death follows very quickly. A shock can have lasting effects upon the nervous system which can also be very debilitating. Hybrid cars are now at the stage where the batteries can deliver a fatal current if incorrectly worked on. Not sure about the electric Osset’s but four 12 volt batteries hooked up to supply 48 volts more if fully charged is boarder line to having a nasty effect upon the human body. ⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️?♂️ Edited October 3, 2018 by section swept Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcman56 Posted October 3, 2018 Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 I may have had it easy. It was a 6 volt points controlled ignition that was already 25 years old at the time. The coil had 2 leads that fired two plugs at the same time. Modern ignitions must have a lot more zap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PB1980 Posted October 3, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 7 hours ago, section swept said: The bodies reaction to electric shock is a muscle spasm that can take a long time to settle down...luckily that 50,000 volts is only about 0.5 of an amp so it shouldn’t kill you unless you are unlucky enough to suffer epilepsy. When you bang your funny bone that pain multiplied by 100+ equals the sort of pain. Some people can touch the HT leads without any shock but they tend to have very dry skin usually calussed as well. If you have soft skin or clammy skin look ? out⚡️I’ve seen a moto x rider flung to the other side of the track when he decided to pull the HT lead off his revving out bike...the muscle spasm must have really hurt he was stretchered off the track. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PB1980 Posted October 3, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 By the sounds of things I got off lightly just felt like a 240v shock . But I did do the classic and touch it again just to make sure ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scifi Posted October 3, 2018 Report Share Posted October 3, 2018 I think the current is much less than 0.5A , cos if you work out the power ( VxI=W.) you would get 50,000 x 0.5 = 25 kilowatts... Nothing on the bike, including the engine produces that amount of power. I think the current will be much smaller, maybe micro amps, or milli amps at the most. There were 5, 000 ohm resistors that you could insert into the plug leads, which would reduce radio interference, yet do very little in reducing the voltage. Your plug lead needs a much higher insulation to avoid the current leaking to ground, or to your fingers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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