Stop allowed for 2020

[jimmyl]

3 hours ago, nickday1 said:

So has there been definitive rules for BTC?

stop and hop allowed with 1 minute time limit. Is this all 3 routes in BTC? And is this likely to filter down to the more traditional trials - S3 and nationals etc?

assume clubs at their own free will to decide what they want to implement within club trials. 

As I read the press release the rules are for BTC only. As ACU handbook is not out yet I guess we can only ponder if these rules will be allowed in any other event but  time will confirm one way or another. As organisers have already agreed to to run the other championships presume they will be running as they did in 2019.

[NAD1]

1 hour ago, jimmyl said:

As I read the press release the rules are for BTC only. As ACU handbook is not out yet I guess we can only ponder if these rules will be allowed in any other event but  time will confirm one way or another. As organisers have already agreed to to run the other championships presume they will be running as they did in 2019.

Ha.... so organisers need to let out 1 load of sections with time limit in mind and the rest with no stop in mind... even when the ACU do the right thing they it so wrong ??‍♂️

[breagh]

Said this for years it's the bikes that need limited not more rules;

Stick a 3.50 back tyre on and no one will be keen to stop.

Still riding with the same size tyre as my dad did on his Gold Star BSA weighing 400lb and 5 inches of ground clearance.

Sammy Millers said this for years (not the bit about my dad) but what would he know. 

 

[baldilocks]

8 hours ago, nickday1 said:

Ha.... so organisers need to let out 1 load of sections with time limit in mind and the rest with no stop in mind... even when the ACU do the right thing they it so wrong ??‍♂️

All classes at a British championship round will have a time limit is how I read it. But the "new " rules don't apply to other series like s3 etc. I don't see how this is a problem for an organiser as they are different events on different days. Try it at BTC and see how it goes, s3 champs doesn't have a problem with entries.

Don't see any need to have a pop at the acu. 

[jimmyl]

11 minutes ago, baldilocks said:

All classes at a British championship round will have a time limit is how I read it. But the "new " rules don't apply to other series like s3 etc. I don't see how this is a problem for an organiser as they are different events on different days. Try it at BTC and see how it goes, s3 champs doesn't have a problem with entries.

Don't see any need to have a pop at the acu. 

Thought that’s what I said so thanks reconfirming ??

[nigel dabster]

3 hours ago, breagh said:

Said this for years it's the bikes that need limited not more rules;

Stick a 3.50 back tyre on and no one will be keen to stop.

Still riding with the same size tyre as my dad did on his Gold Star BSA weighing 400lb and 5 inches of ground clearance.

Sammy Millers said this for years (not the bit about my dad) but what would he know. 

 

Sammy's not right here.

Practically it's a non starter, to limit tyres would be impossible now, and I'm not sure there would ever be a consensus to do it.

Stopping is not related to tyre design either.

[on it]

4 hours ago, breagh said:

Said this for years it's the bikes that need limited not more rules;

Stick a 3.50 back tyre on and no one will be keen to stop.

Still riding with the same size tyre as my dad did on his Gold Star BSA weighing 400lb and 5 inches of ground clearance.

Sammy Millers said this for years (not the bit about my dad) but what would he know. 

 

Yes bikes have got better over the years .BUT sorry the standard of ridding has fallen 

Very few riders even at world round can get the most out of the bike, the problem is not the bikes its the sections too tight and technical for non stop ,but with hop and stop no

turn will be too tight next gripe will be the sections are too long for the time limit !

Ive been watching BTC on y tube and i can see fully why they have gone stop allowed, turns far to tight so most are ridden stop and hop

the rule change all this is doing is playing into the top riders hands as they can hop around easy now ,so its giving them more of a advantage

Is the only  change needed  is  give the observer a score card and do away with punch cards only he/ she knows whats score is given with no fear of aggro from riders /minders like now with punch cards 

[timp]

Certainly worth a try as no stop at top level wasn't too good.

But going off entry levels was no-stop a bad move?.

I think entry levels have been overall better than the previous rules? 

The concern for the new rules is perhaps 1 minute isn't enough. It may lead to rushing the last bit of the hazard and the lower routes havn't got a minder to catch for them either.

No doubt there will be plenty of arguments that the front spindle was out just as the whistle is blown and joe blogs got an extra second because he knows the observer!?

Anyway not my problem so I leave it to the ones onvolved?

Edited November 25, 2019 by timp

[heffergm]

60 seconds feels a bit short to me (unless the section are shortened up obviously). The Italian and US nationals (stop allowed) are 90 seconds. I'd have to go back and double check, but I think the Spanish are similar. So I guess the question would be why didn't they just adopt the same time limit that every other stop allowed national championship uses.

Edited November 27, 2019 by heffergm

[lineaway]

On 11/19/2019 at 3:38 AM, on it said:

Yes bikes have got better over the years .BUT sorry the standard of ridding has fallen 

Very few riders even at world round can get the most out of the bike, the problem is not the bikes its the sections too tight and technical for non stop ,but with hop and stop no

turn will be too tight next gripe will be the sections are too long for the time limit !

Ive been watching BTC on y tube and i can see fully why they have gone stop allowed, turns far to tight so most are ridden stop and hop

the rule change all this is doing is playing into the top riders hands as they can hop around easy now ,so its giving them more of a advantage

Is the only  change needed  is  give the observer a score card and do away with punch cards only he/ she knows whats score is given with no fear of aggro from riders /minders like now with punch cards 

In 1990 the world ride riders could balance all day long. They would stop and back up to the beginning of a section and then clean it. All with out the all day dab. Trouble is a team could dnf the competition due to time. The level of competition was extremely high. It has been down hill ever since. You have the best post I have seen in awhile. It is tough on the scorer`s either way we go. The penalty exists to stop the riders aggression, but it takes a scorer with balls. Most scorer`s are not out there for that purpose. Good luck fixing the BTC.

[nigel dabster]

On 11/25/2019 at 1:50 PM, timp said:

Certainly worth a try as no stop at top level wasn't too good.

But going off entry levels was no-stop a bad move?.

I think entry levels have been overall better than the previous rules? 

The concern for the new rules is perhaps 1 minute isn't enough. It may lead to rushing the last bit of the hazard and the lower routes havn't got a minder to catch for them either.

No doubt there will be plenty of arguments that the front spindle was out just as the whistle is blown and joe blogs got an extra second because he knows the observer!?

Anyway not my problem so I leave it to the ones onvolved?

automatic timing no whistle, but yes judgement if spindle is out. At world level a few years back i mustve watch hundreds of section attempts but judgement on was it out or not maybe a couple of times.

Edited December 1, 2019 by nigel dabster

[nigel dabster]

On 11/19/2019 at 10:38 AM, on it said:

Yes bikes have got better over the years .BUT sorry the standard of ridding has fallen 

Very few riders even at world round can get the most out of the bike, the problem is not the bikes its the sections too tight and technical for non stop ,but with hop and stop no

turn will be too tight next gripe will be the sections are too long for the time limit !

Ive been watching BTC on y tube and i can see fully why they have gone stop allowed, turns far to tight so most are ridden stop and hop

the rule change all this is doing is playing into the top riders hands as they can hop around easy now ,so its giving them more of a advantage

Is the only  change needed  is  give the observer a score card and do away with punch cards only he/ she knows whats score is given with no fear of aggro from riders /minders like now with punch cards 

you dont think that Adam and Toni are the best riders ever in tackling the hardest sections ever?

[on it]

1 hour ago, nigel dabster said:

you dont think that Adam and Toni are the best riders ever in tackling the hardest sections ever?

try to keep up  nigel  !  the topic is  BTC ! not WTC  and as i say the standard has dropped  is this due to no grading systems in place ? rides made out to be better than they really are, also runs before they start BTC   

[timp]

On 12/1/2019 at 11:16 AM, nigel dabster said:

automatic timing no whistle, but yes judgement if spindle is out. At world level a few years back i mustve watch hundreds of section attempts but judgement on was it out or not maybe a couple of times.

What was the section time limit back then? I seem to remember 1.5 minutes but may be way out.

1 minute seems an expensive event. 3 laps of 15. 45 minutes riding time per event.

[NAD1]

On 11/27/2019 at 12:14 PM, heffergm said:

60 seconds feels a bit short to me (unless the section are shortened up obviously). The Italian and US nationals (stop allowed) are 90 seconds. I'd have to go back and double check, but I think the Spanish are similar. So I guess the question would be why didn't they just adopt the same time limit that every other stop allowed national championship uses.

Too simple to have same rules ?