boydw Posted August 29, 2006 Report Share Posted August 29, 2006 I have a mate who has watched trials and ridden a bit, owns a couple of bikes and he summed it up completely over the weekend with "Who is going to invest or pay large numbers of cone heads (trials riders) to ride up becks and over rocks, and then get there feet wet and have to venture out in the cold - when they could spend there money on other more viable sports" He has a valid point, I bet if you went to a particular section at the ssdt or scott you would bump into at least 60% of the people you saw the previous year - it was just the same at this years world round at hawkestone. Its the same old people supporting these events year after year. There are only a significant amount of people who are interested. They put off shore power boat racing on tv - does that mean they are going to get extra entries at world events - are they buggery!!! Its just it is an exciting sport, with an attractive way of life for its sponsors - lets think about it - monte carlo, on a beach with a load of women in bikini's a rake of stella and food on tap, couple of big tv screens, or Hawkestone in the rain, and a couple of tmx birds strutting around in a pair of shorts looking totally pi55ed off at a bunch of "cone heads" watching "cone heads". The WTC trials scene will only evolve as the top flight riders make it evolve as will the BTC scene. Club events are booming - ie richmond, Y&G etc so why try and push the sport into something it is never going to be! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kinell Posted August 29, 2006 Report Share Posted August 29, 2006 Hawkestone in the rain, and a couple of tmx birds strutting around in a pair of shorts looking totally pi55ed off at a bunch of "cone heads" watching "cone heads". Classic Andy, let's have a 'Quote of the Month' award on TC somewhere. I'll donate a can of Stella to Boyd for this beauty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judyf Posted August 29, 2006 Report Share Posted August 29, 2006 good points boyd, its true the national scene ie, the scott, ssdt, cleveland, white rose etc are booming with entrys, and also much more enjoyable than the btc and the wtc, good little comments aswell. nicework. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boydw Posted August 29, 2006 Report Share Posted August 29, 2006 One can - you can tell you come from over the border you tight git! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atomant Posted August 29, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 29, 2006 Televising trials whether its in the current form or 'developed' for TV viewing doesn't need more people on the ground at events to make it work. Income from TV rights would help fill the coffers albeit a small amount at first. It needs someone with a bit of dosh to take a gamble on the sport and see how it goes. Also, my wife said to me at Hawkstone that she was suprised that with all the guys riding round in Lycra, there wasn't a big Gay following for the sport . I said there is, just go over into that fenced off tent in the far corner of that field over there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boydw Posted August 29, 2006 Report Share Posted August 29, 2006 you are dead right atomant- but who is going to invest money into the sport, it has been tried for years and still no luck - the best thing that ever happened to trials was kickstart - but you tell people you ride a trials bike and they go "oh so you ride over a few oil drums, and up and down a trailer" Lets face it you can get 30'000 people to watch 22 overpaid fairies kick a bag of wind round for 90 minutes - who's going or wants to watch 15 - 20 lycra clad men ride there bikes up rocks and streams for 5 - 6 hours. Only people who are interested! Everyone can play football, and dream of being beckham, for trialling you need to outlay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atomant Posted August 29, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 29, 2006 Its never going to happen!!! Never say Never ! Firstly, I think it needs something different as I have said before for TV. Could be something completely different to what we watch at outdoors for example. In the Indoor at Sheffield this year, whilst there was loads of 'traditional' awesome trials riding taking place, the talking point was when Bou rode the barrels on the back wheel at speed beating Raga in the ride off. Think about this for a minute. What did that moment display? [1] Tremedous skill & ability [2] 1 V 1 Race conditions [3] Speed [4] Excitement What about an event based on a dual course with 2 identical man made sections where riders ride off against the clock. Footing gives time penalties only. It would certainly provide the above 4 things and maybe enough to draw a wider audience. Also, I would suggest that the governing body sets aside a percentage of any future income to invest into the grass roots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the artist formerly known as ish Posted August 29, 2006 Report Share Posted August 29, 2006 You mean MX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted August 29, 2006 Report Share Posted August 29, 2006 Interesting stuff not too sure the reality of "booming national events" is true at all. Yes the reeth 3 day is bursting but what is the average age? I am more concerned that the youngsters are not entering the sport and sticking with it. The wtc and BTC are different now than say the 70/80's when an average rider could get round, I did and now its a different thing altogether, likewise the wtc is beyond most and as for making it easy enough for Dan Thorpe to do is just plain daft, doug fuji and the others would all be clean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atomant Posted August 29, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 29, 2006 You mean MX No, not at all. I'm just throwing in ideas in the hope that one of them might lead to something! This forum has 2500 members and whilst its easy for someone to come up with a reason why this (or other ideas) wont work, I dont see many coming up with ways on how it can be made to work simply because forward thinking ideas get someone having a knock. No wonder the sport is stuck in the 20th century! The Dabster makes a good point on keeping youngsters in the sport. I would suggest that when the upcoming stars get to the stage when they have hit a wall and cant get where they want, they (and the parents) get a reality check and decide the money may be better spent elsewhere. Then for a 18 - 20 year old, other priorities may come into play! What will happen I suggest is what happens to a lot of us. We come back into the sport at a later date and then some of us mugs get involved in running clubs etc and it all keeps going. When the guys running clubs dry up then thats it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the artist formerly known as ish Posted August 29, 2006 Report Share Posted August 29, 2006 What is the second hand market like for moving bikes on, are they many 06 bikes left in the showroom or at the importers, that is the true indicater on how well the sport is doing. I think Dabster touched on it, age!! when dad is footing the bill for a kid to ride, it's great, when they have to pay their own way, it's a different story, girls, beer, chav mobile, can't have it all, trials bike is the first thing to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judyf Posted August 30, 2006 Report Share Posted August 30, 2006 dabster you have some good points but your also missing the point, for one i said make at least 4 sections to national standard just to make other people think they might wanna give it a go, and the whole talk wasnt just about the wtc, everyone whos that no matter the standard of sections the same names would be the front, and what would be the point of a "nearly hard enough world trials champs" but at the same time wouldnt it be nice to have a world champion on all different types of terrain and types of section? i know dan thorpe is never going to world champion but at the same time get thorpey and raga up in scotland or in a trial like the jack wood and thorpe would give him a run for his money! dan thorpe is the best national trials rider in the traditional trials and should be able to have a go at a few sections. this post started with where will trials go and all im saying that if the dont make a few changes to the standard of sections it will get silly, but at the end of the day there is no money in the sport so its always going to be hard, as makes of bikes are finding it hard to make money, so they make enduro aswell. i just think the wtc is a circus at the moment. and with just a few changes it could be made into a better championship with more riders, instaed of 12! my dad could ride of his bsa and get 3 wtc points! how gay is that! and not just going to sit at my computer and just point fingers because i would be willing to do every i can to help and put ideas forward, im involed with setting alot of trials out, and my family has been involed for about 50years so im not just sticking me two pennys in, there just needs to be a change, before the rider has to have a rocket up his a*** to get up the sections and a million ounds in the bank to compete at the top level! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atomant Posted August 30, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2006 Your points theused are typical of the general comments being made like "Something has to be done" so many people sympathise with your viewpoint but the question is what can/should be done? Keeping on the original theme of this post, lets have some solid suggestions ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judyf Posted August 30, 2006 Report Share Posted August 30, 2006 yeah i know were kind of going off the path, i think the wtc needs, 1) stops a 1 rule back 2) try and encourge more riders to ride by having a few ridable sections 3) maybe try having an international class so adult riders can ride the junior route, but get pionts towards the championship 4) be able to drop 2 or more rounds becaues not everyone can afford to go to japan etc, 5) all riders to ride standard machinery Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordson major Posted August 30, 2006 Report Share Posted August 30, 2006 (edited) yeah i know were kind of going off the path, i think the wtc needs,1) stops a 1 rule back 2) try and encourge more riders to ride by having a few ridable sections 3) maybe try having an international class so adult riders can ride the junior route, but get pionts towards the championship 4) be able to drop 2 or more rounds becaues not everyone can afford to go to japan etc, 5) all riders to ride standard machinery I agree with most of the points there except 1) Just a personal thing, I prefer the current FIM rules There's some good ideas there, especially the idea of the international class. I think if the world championship class were to be made easier we would end up with a situation like the 2005 Japan round where the top 6/7 riders were seperated by about 2 marks. The world championship course needs to be hard so that the elite riders are finnishing on about 40/50 marks . Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the European championship have an international class? As for section difficulty (sorry to repeat myself) but I think the answer is to move off the dry,grippy massive steps and put in more traditional sections where you realy have to battle for grip. I think this'd also solve the rule situation as stopping would put you at a disadvantage anyway so this'd discourage stopping/balancing. Just my opinion... Edited August 30, 2006 by Beta120690 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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